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Microsoft To Enable User-Created Xbox 360 Games
Posted by
samzenpus
on Mon Aug 14, 2006 07:05 AM
from the play-nice dept.
from the play-nice dept.
simoniker writes "Talking on the eve of its Gamefest event in Seattle, Microsoft has revealed XNA Game Studio Express, a new product which will allow indie developers and students to develop simultaneously on Xbox 360 and PC, and share their games to others in a new Xbox 360 'Creators Club'. XNA Game Studio Express will be available for free to anyone with a Windows XP-based PC, and will provide them with what's described as "Microsoft's next-generation platform for game development." In addition, by joining a "creators club" for an annual subscription fee of $99, users will be able to build, test and share their games on Xbox 360, as well as access a wealth of materials to help speed the game development progress."
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Game Innovation by the Bedroom Coder 47 comments
scriptedfun writes "The BBC reports on how bedroom coders might regain their place in the game development world by providing the industry 'an injection of imagination.' Microsoft's XNA Game Studio Express (covered previously on Slashdot) is given a special mention, but the article points out that 'the concept behind XNA is nothing new,' citing Sony's Net Yaroze as another example. With user-generated content fueling innovation in many aspects of technology, current initiatives by the major players to provide easy access to game development tools may just redefine the face of next-gen gaming. Peter Molyneux, creator of Populous, says: 'It's 100% down to the passion that people have, and the ability to perhaps bring in other people, maybe from all around the world on the internet, and create something.'"
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Microsoft To Enable User-Created Xbox 360 Games
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Great! (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Great! (Score:5, Funny)
My game will be called... (Score:5, Funny)
(http://netapps.com.au/)
.... "Linux kernel"
Re:My game will be called... (Score:5, Funny)
Microsoft has detected an error in the naming of your game.
The term 'Linux' is a trademarked entity and as such cannot be used as the title of your game.
Sincerely
Billy boy
ps, even if it weren't trademarked, we still wouldn't let you have it you commie pig
Re:My game will be called... (Score:5, Insightful)
Who cares?
This is designed for the hobbyist/amateur game developer. A managed environment built on top of a decent framework from Microsoft will allow a much broader audience of enthusiasts out there to create games. Instead of fumbling with buggy or complicated code, they will actually get to express their creativity and fresh designs.
Re:My game will be called... (Score:4, Insightful)
See, by "giving" this kit away to amateur gamers, they are essentially guaranteeing a long line of new games which only run under a closed Microsoft platform. This ensures that people will continue buying their Windows OS in order to run the tools/games. It's actually a very strategic move by MS, and unfortunately it is likely to work.
Re:My game will be called... (Score:5, Funny)
(Last Journal: Monday August 22 2005, @11:02AM)
Re:My game will be called... (Score:5, Funny)
(http://evil.google.com/)
Why a subscription fee? (Score:1)
(Last Journal: Monday September 24, @05:13PM)
Re:Why a subscription fee? (Score:4, Insightful)
I believe they were charing significantly more for the full scale developers kit/package which companies like EA Sports and such buy into. This makes a "tinkering/homebrew" entry point into that arena for what is only the cost of a couple games.
Re:Why a subscription fee? (Score:4, Insightful)
(http://thoughthead.com/)
By charging a subscription fee you can have your cake and eat it too. Garage developers can make AND RUN their homebrew software for a fairly low cost $100 really isn't that much, and the subscription fee lets MS allow that kind of development without breaking their profit model, essentially making up the money they're "loosing" by not selling you games.
while it might be a bit more expensive then chipping your console a lot of people will opt for the legal route if available. Not to mention I can see a whole lot of non-developers signing up just to run the homebrew stuff made by the real developers. I'll tell you what, if they make an XBMC360 and it's availble on this thing, I'll pay the $100 a year to run that and other software, weather I'm developing my own software or not. I would imagine there will be a lot of other people in the same boat. MS basically found a way to allow homebrew software and turn a profit at the same time... crafty buggers.
Re:Why a subscription fee? (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://slashdot.org/)
Weight Watchers (the only example I can think of right now) has the same principle. They charge you $10-12 a week for their program whether you attend or not. They don't really do anything but weigh you and give you some rah-rah speeches to keep you motivated. The financial cost is there because, psychologically, people who have a vested financial interest in something tend to follow through with it more often and more completely.
Killer Feature (Score:5, Insightful)
There's so many extremely simple games that are insanely fun multiplayer, and will probably never, ever be released as stand-alone games.
I'm still praying the Nintendo Wii will be opened up like this, but if it isn't, this might be what tips me over to XBOX 360. Programming for the Wii-controllers would be fun though, and I really, really want to play Pong with them
Re:Killer Feature (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://www.kibbee.ca/)
Re:Killer Feature (Score:5, Insightful)
2) Even if Nintendo does give you a dev kit, that doesn't mean you'll be able to release games for their system. All consoles have a logo program, and games that aren't vetted and approved can't be run. That's not to say it'll be trivial for you to get Microsoft to approve your game, but at least Microsoft is out there assuring people that it'll happen.
3) $1700 vs. $99/year. If you're paying $1700 for something, you're basically already a full-time game developer. $99/year is cheap enough so that Microsoft is going to have tons and tons of people on their kit, and they'll be able to pick and choose the best from the lot. Plus, you can start development of your game for free... the $99 is just for access to more documentation and Xbox portability. You can develop and release you PC version for free, THEN decide to pay $99 to port to Xbox and try to get it on Live.
4) Isn't it telling that every time Microsoft announces something truly innovative and, frankly, pretty damn refreshing, there has to be a counter-post saying that Nintendo has the same thing... even if they don't? I love Slashdot. Give credit where credit is due... this is a great move on Microsoft's part, and a win-win for every gamer out there.
Fragmenting the community. (Score:3, Interesting)
E.g. Alien Swarm has about 4 decent servers, and a community of 100 players.
Well color me impressed... (Score:5, Interesting)
Now don't get me wrong, I'm sure a lot of the games will probably suck eggs, but it might just turn out that we'd see some real innovation in design and concept with an infusion of fresh development blood. Because you never know, one of those hobbists/indie designers might crank out something good enough to either a) get picked up by an existing studio or b) generate enough interest from others to start up their own studio. Then it just becomes a matter of being a good enough businessman to keep things working.
Re:Well color me impressed... (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://plan99.net/~mike/)
I think this is fantastic news, if only because it offers a cool and enticing way into programming for the younger generation (shit that makes me sound old ...)
If you interview a random sample of programmers in the world today I bet a lot of the 25-30 aged ones will have got started by writing cheesy games as kids for their {Commodore 64/Sinclair Spectrum/BBC Micro}, even if they then went into corporate software, operating systems, embedded work or whatever. Learning to write software by doing databases in Visual Basic is boring. Learning to write software by doing cool games you can add multiplayer to and beat your friends at is a much better proposition.
Wasn't the head of Nintendo saying that it's a shame games are no longer feasable for hobbyists and entry level studios? It's surprising Microsoft beat them to it, but then Visual Studio Express was designed for the home/hobbyist developer as well if I remember correctly so maybe not too surprising. Here's hoping it becomes a trend and the next generation of coders are learning threading by actually doing it, instead of memorizing lecture slides.
next step (Score:2, Funny)
(http://www.cube.dyndns.org/~rsnel/)
Anyone know what's included? (Score:1)
Developers, Developers, Developers (Score:5, Funny)
(Last Journal: Thursday December 08 2005, @04:33PM)
XNA & Your Rights (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://slashdot.org/~eldavojohn/ | Last Journal: Tuesday October 16, @03:26PM)
So it could be a standard American Idol style:
1) trick contestants into signing away all rights they have to their work
2) let the community decide who is the best
3) publish their work and profit!
If you have preliminary questions about the XBox 360, you can find it on their forums [microsoft.com].
Re:XNA & Your Rights (Score:5, Informative)
(http://www-users.cs.york.ac.uk/~aw)
It definitely looks like 1 is not the case, and given that he also says "I'd love to send a royalty cheque to a kid" 3 could well be it.
Andrew
this is going to boost their sales (Score:1)
Sounds cool (Score:2)
(Last Journal: Sunday November 06 2005, @10:30PM)
$99 a year? (Score:2, Insightful)
(http://www.parallelrealities.co.uk/)
They're kidding, right? $99 to develop a game that only a handful of people might play, and as a student having no income. You could get a job though to pay the fee, but when would you have time to code? And what happens if you develop the next Geometry Wars? Do you own the rights to have it published or will Microsoft just pay you royalties (that probably wouldn't make you back your $99 either).
Here's a suggestion, set up a page on My Space with a link to, say, a File Planet for the binaries.
I'd never subject Blob and Conquer to this.
How fun! (Score:3, Insightful)
(http://www.andrew.cmu.edu/user/bsauerwi/index.html)
~Ben
Good 'ol game designer (Score:2)
(http://www.meatpipe.com/)
Impressed (Score:2)
Am really impressed by this cool move from the Redmond's boys, but got a lot of questions over it. How will it bypass the anti-copy game protection? Will it be a true SDK with full access to all the key components or a crippled down OS with no ability to get the juice from the optical disk nor 3D CPUs like the SONY's attempt with the ps2 [wikipedia.org]?
--
Superb hosting [tinyurl.com] 20GB Storage, 1_TB_ bandwidth, php, mysql, ssh, $7.95
Potential (Score:1)
Totally Off-topic (Score:1, Offtopic)
(http://www.marsdude.com/)
Let me get this straight (Score:3, Funny)
Brilliant. I'm going to start a company right away, and I'll make sure to hire lots of developers to pay me.
Homebrew & Backups & ... Linux :) (Score:1)
Even if the code is digitally signed to the creator and Microsoft enforces him not to create these kind of applications, just look at what happened to the PSP, there were a bug in the PSP was exploited to make a patch to downgrade the firmware until a firmware that Sony itself had made with a nasty (or very nice
Now, you could just make a game and even without intention, that game could have a bug that could be exploited the same way on the XBOX 360 and really Microsoft couldn' prosecute someone just because that person is a bad coder an opened an exploit to the XBOX 360.
Who says Slashdot always bashes Microsoft? (Score:5, Insightful)
Lets take bets... (Score:4, Funny)
(http://winterblink.com/)
Alterior motives? (Score:2)
I don't keep up with XBox360 game development but is this a subtle hint by Microsoft to get more developerment on the Xbox360? Seriously, I don't know. I can see this as a tactic.
"If you don't develop more games, someone else will . . . maybe the gamers. And we'll get their games and their money. And your little dog, too!"
I can finally do that game about the sassy robot!! (Score:2)
-Eric
Painful distribution.... (Score:5, Informative)
(http://www.reeb.freeserve.co.uk/)
Q: How exactly can I share my 360 game to other 360 users? Will my game only be available to people with the XNA "Creators Club" subscription? Will it be available to all 360 users that have an Xbox Live account?
A: There is currently no supported way to share binaries on the Xbox 360. Currently, there are four requirements that must be met in order to share a game targeting Xbox 360 which is developed with XNA Game Studio Express.
1. The individual you are planning to share the game with must be logged in to Xbox Live and have an active subscription to the XNA Creators Club
2. The receiving user must have downloaded the XNA Framework runtime environment for the Xbox 360
3. The receiving user must have XNA Game Studio Express installed on their own development PC
4. The game project, including all source and content assets, must be shared with the receiving user. The receiving user then compiles and deploys the game to their Xbox 360.
Doesnt exactly sound like a barrel of laughs to distribute to friends etc...
Another take on the situation (Score:2)
Great move. (Score:1)
(http://www.slashdot.org/)
Some good can come of this (Score:1)
Bold Move (Score:3, Interesting)
(http://bluezhift.proliphus.com/ | Last Journal: Wednesday January 31 2007, @10:25AM)
Microsoft still doesn't get it... (Score:1)
(http://www.anomalouscow.com/ | Last Journal: Friday March 29 2002, @11:28AM)
No subscription fee. Open the API and allow game development from any platform ( yes, even *nix ). Allow others to share the games, for free.
Heres where you make your money. If you want to sell your games, you need to buy a license to brand it as an Xbox game. Then they can still get their kickbacks, and the hobbyists don't have to sell their souls.
Re:Microsoft still doesn't get it... (Score:4, Insightful)
(http://www.jerrywong.net/)
One of the consequences of FOSS is that now everyone wants everything for free. God forbid you pay for a library! What's with the sense of entitlement here?
MS has a brand image to keep with the Xbox. To allow unfettered distribution of homebrew is a disaster. Remember that there are certain types of content that MS would rather keep off Xboxes, even if it wasn't authorized or endorsed by MS. Adult games, games featuring direct explicit illegalities... knowing the internet and YouTube, we have an immense ability to create content that the Xbox brand does NOT want to be associated with. There is absolutely nothing wrong with MS wanting control of distribution, if only for this purpose alone.
So the idea will be to put a crutch on homebrew distribution, so that MS can pick the cream of the crop for official endorsement, and probably un-handicap the game for full XBLA distribution, free or otherwise. This will allow you and your buddies to have fun throwing pr0n and other shenanigans on the Xbox360, but disallow you from doing any real damage through mass distribution.
And what's with the "XP only" game development? It's the .NET Framework for cryin' out loud. *AND* it's Managed DirectX! This concerns Linux/UNIX zealots none. We're not talking about a C++ library for OpenGL here, this thing simply *cannot* run in 'nix. The Xbox360 runs DX only, and one of the concepts here is getting rid of complex C++ and throwing in simpler C#, none of these quite fit with 'nix eh (Mono doesn't count)?
Do you seriously think MS is intending on sucking $100/year out of every developer? Are you seriously believing that MS intends the subscription fee to be a profitable industry? There won't be enough devs out there for this to be anything but a drop in the bucket to MS. I suspect the fee is more of a barrier to entry requirement to keep your everyday kids out and encourage some serious development - without setting the price as high as to keep interested (and qualified) parties out.
Hmmm (Score:1)
Just when my contempt for MS was at its peak... (Score:2)
(http://slackerrevolution.com/)
And... (Score:2)
I think this is an absolutely phenomenal idea, and I'm very excited about doing some hobbyist development with it.
About the 99$ fee. (Score:2)
I can't wait to download it!
Ohhhh so thats what too so long. (Score:1)
Thats what took them so long to release dev tools... they just needed to figure out how to price it.
you haters are incredible. this is GREAT news. (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://gummibearheads.com/)
did you guys say "oh great now we can have shitty mods" when the iD guys gave access to the WAD files?
How about when Valve let people have access to the half-life engine? Isn't counterstrike still the most played online game? I'm willing to bet that a serious portion of the half life cds have been sold just to play counterstrick.
What happened to the guys who made the Desert Combat mod for BF1942? Oh yeah, they got hired by the company and improved the game.
Look at the success of Xbox Live Arcade. You have a plethora of PC game developers making games and selling them on the Xbox system. These are all guys who could never make console games in the past.
MS made a bunch of tools to help developers make their PC games work on 360 and vice versa.
So now MS wants to let even more people in, and you guys bitch about it? Why because you have to pay $99? or because some kid will make a donkey kong clone with steve jobs and bill gates? or because you have to have a 360?
I'm willing to bet that some kick ass games come out as a result of this. Maybe some kid gets hired by a company and makes a truly kick ass game like Geometry Wars. Maybe some game comes out and gets noticed and picked up for Arcade. Who knows.
If you dont want to do it, keep the $99 in your pocket. But only good stuff can come out of this.
.Net Only (Score:1)
(http://www.1bit.com.br/)
For those wondering ... (Score:1)
Q: What does XNA stand for?
A: XNA's Not Acronymed
It seems this is what Microsoft said that they were learning to embrace open source software!
My first title (Score:2)
Thanks,
Leabre
Funny (Score:1)
(http://www.angelfire...epublican/index.blog | Last Journal: Thursday July 27 2006, @12:00AM)
So let me get this straight.
Homebrew Developers are supposed to pay Microsoft for the priveledge of making new content for their system that will be given away for free but that Microsoft can claim when they list the number of titles available on their platform when they advertise to compete with the PS3?
I suppose that $99.00 per year is better than Sony is going to charge to develop for the PS3, but I don't think that this is any real reason to celebrate.
LK
In-Game Advertising (Score:1)
(http://www.virtualblend.com/)
Linux isn't possible, stop dreaming (Score:2)
On the 360, the page table is managed by a hypervisor etched into ROM inside the CPU. A page is never marked as executable unless it has passed an RSA signature check. The kernel does not have the authority to mark a page as executable.
Sure, you could get the Linux kernel running, but how would you get bash, gcc, perl, ls, cp,
Microsoft's FAQ talks about C# only. Gee, what a surprise. I think this means that the dynamic recompiler is inside the hypervisor, since it can't be anywhere else. You can bet that all programs will have to be verifiable. Otherwise, exploits ahoy.
Melissa
boothbabes (Score:1)
(http://www.eelke.com/)
Re:Yaroze (Score:2)
Re:mod chips? (Score:1)
There will remain the requirement to hack the box just to see if it can be done though ...
Re:Microsoft Can't Be Serious (Score:2)
It isn't true.
Yes, the PS3 "runs" linux.
Embedded Linux.
You will never 'see' it. You will see a nice shiny PSP style XMB menu. You will not be able to
code a damn thing (legitimatly). Sony has never once said you would be able to. Stop spreading
old shot down rumors.
Re:Yaroze (Score:1)
Re:mod chips? (Score:2)
Oh and there needs to be MAME360 and MESS260 too to cover the emulation side (and with the power of the 360 CPUs you could certainly emulate anything with 8 and 16 bit CPUs including things like Neo-Geo and CPS2 that required too much memory and CPU for the original XBOX and probably a number of games using 32 bit CPUs too)
Provide those few apps in a way that doesnt require spending big bucks to play them and a sizable chunk of the "I want a mod chip to run homebrew code" market would be satisfied.
User created games, or just textures? (Score:1)
(http://myatomic.com/ | Last Journal: Sunday November 19 2006, @12:31AM)
Clothing in Animal Crossing and emblems in Mario Kart don't count.