Microsoft Retires Windows 98 697
prostoalex writes "Complying with the court requirement related to Sun-Microsoft lawsuit over Java, Microsoft is retiring Windows 98, SQL Server 7, Office XP Developer Edition and some other products."
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Microsoft Retires Windows 98
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Order and simplification are the first steps toward mastery of a subject -- the actual enemy is the unknown. -- Thomas Mann
So? (Score:5, Insightful)
So I guess it's no big deal. How does this harm Microsoft? Win98 is (was) a nice and stable gaming platform, but XP is very stable for gaming too. This counts as a win on the record, but it's still too little too late, imho. Sun should be awarded more rights over *current* and *future* Microsoft products, as a penalty. This could get interesting!
Re:So? (Score:5, Funny)
Did you just refer to Win98 as "stable?" Good god, you're delusional.
Re:So? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:So? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:So? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:So? (Score:4, Funny)
Oh, sorry. My mistake.
I thought you were talking about running Win-98 for weeks without a reboot.
silly comment of the minute:
"I've been booting my Linux box daily for the last year. The computer's fine, but my shoe's starting to wear out."
Re:So? (Score:3, Interesting)
Win98, on the other hand, I've never had success in keeping relatively stable.
Re:So? (Score:5, Funny)
Granted keeping 98 on there for weeks without a reinstall is an admirable feat.
It works both ways, folks... (Score:4, Insightful)
Seriously, in *every* case where someone complains that their Windows setup is unstable, I've found one of three factors is actually at fault:
1) Crap hardware and/or drivers
2) Lack of basic maintenance (frex, defragging)
3) Installing tons of crapware/spyware, and/or uninstalling apps via the "random deletia" method
The average Windows install, with *ZERO* maintenance and much abuse, lasts about three years before it reaches a point where most Joe Users think it needs a reformat. Meaning it's gotten slow, and crashes more than once a week or so. (Tho so far I've only seen ONE Windows setup that I couldn't quickly clean up and restore to good working order, *without* a reformat. Reinstalling stuff is against my religion. :)
Serious question: Can a default linux install survive three years of daily abuse and neglect, by clueless users who nonetheless stick their fingers into everything in reach, and still be functional enough to be merely "annoying" (the state at which most folk give up on a neglected WinSetup)??
Linux proponents are always saying that anyone who thinks linux is hard to get running good are just ignorant. Consider that the reverse is also true -- that anyone who can't get Windows to run stable is equally ignorant.
Because frankly, folks, it just ain't that hard. [slashdot.org]
Re:So? (Score:5, Insightful)
98SE is, of course, far from perfect, but I, for one, still use it (don't worry, though -- I dual boot with Red Hat). When my mother-in-law got a new computer with XP on it, I had to spend a couple of weeks hacking and slashing away at its bells and whistles (and security holes and spyware) before it would run acceptably.
XP also suffers from the classic Microsoft "your OS knows what's best for you, and you'd better like it" syndrome. On the other hand, after five years, most of the operational innards of Win98 have been well mapped by generations of hardy explorers, and there are plenty of tools available for tweaking it just so.
Obviously, Win98SE is not the greatest OS of all time; but, in terms of relative stability combined with widespread application compatability, it is certainly the most successful OS Microsoft has ever produced.
I suppose you could look at it as being similar to the late 19th century British cavalry saber -- a form which realized its ideal expression at the same time as it became obsolete.
Never more stable than NT (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Yah I still use 98 (Score:4, Insightful)
Anybody who says that raw c++ is easier than VB is on crack! Microsofts whole business model is based on making it easy for people to build software for the platform.
I write business apps in Python (and VB) using COM and I have to say that it is actually pretty neat as long as your company is already willing to pay the MS Office tax.
Re:So? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:So? (Score:4, Interesting)
Comparison: My record uptime on an XP box is 3 weeks (similar usage). NT/2000 servers at my work stay up for months at a time.
Sure it doesn't beat my Linux boxes which have stayed up for years at a time, but it's no where near the "crashing all the time" reports that I've read.
Windows Me on the other hand....
Re:So? (Score:5, Interesting)
WINXP: stable for gaming? You're the one who's delusional.
I will probably goto Mandrake. I like Linux (been using PCs since 1982) I have a copy of the Windows eXtortion Program (pro edition). I might install it but I have it at work so there's no real point.
I did all my years of networks & servers in the 80s and early 90s. All i want out of my home computer is entertainment (surf the 'net and GAMES GAMES GAMES).
The biggest headache I have about XP is that there isn't an Expert Mode. I absolutely HATE having to waste my time going the baby steps that are there to help inexperienced users (i understand some people need this) but hinder those of us that know what they're doing.
As for stablility: Win2000. I haven't used it much but out of 30-40 techs & net admins that I've talked to, they all seem to agree on this...
Re:So? (Score:5, Insightful)
actually, it helps them. there are millions of administrative assistants and other corporate flunkies who have been happily using win 98 for years.
now that end of life is officially declared, the it deaprtmnt will probably force upgrades on all those people - and, of course, pay the necessary licensing fees to redmond.
microsoft: taking a bad ruling and turning it into a cash cow. again.
Re:So? (Score:5, Insightful)
It doesn't force upgrades. (Score:5, Informative)
ding, dong... (Score:3, Funny)
Upgrade (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Upgrade (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Upgrade (Score:5, Interesting)
The point is that it's there for those inclined to see, to do, to touch, and to modify. And it makes all the difference.
-Sara
Re:Upgrade (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Upgrade (Score:5, Funny)
You must really be looking forward to watching "The Passion". :)
Re:Upgrade (Score:5, Interesting)
What if MS released the windows 98 source code under the GPL or a BSD or Apache style license? Probably that 0.000000000001% of developers who care enough will take it, fix some of the annoying bugs and features in it and create a windows 99 release that can be used by anyone to patch windows98 and create a useable free version (think dr-dos being released and now used as a minimul dos environment by various companies, ie: apple's virtual pc uses it as a base dos install).
Maybe that wouldn't happen, maybe it would. Without he code being available, it *can't*.
Re:Upgrade (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Upgrade (Score:4, Informative)
This isn't even a fair comparison. If I don't like KFC, for whatever reason, my decision to go somewhere else (or even make my own) will be virtually without cost. Why? Because chicken isn't closed-source. If I decide I don't like Microsoft, I always have to weigh my options against the very real cost of installing and learning a new OS, converting my old documents, potential compatibility issues, etc. Why? Because Microsoft is closed-source, and is often, by design, incompatible with other potential options.
Re:Upgrade (Score:4, Insightful)
You silly, it would be used to create libwin32.so.98 and some kernel modules, and native windows applications would run about anywhere.
Re:Upgrade (Score:3, Insightful)
When Microsoft discontinues Win98, there is NOONE ELSE who can support Win98. You are stuck. With open-source, any company can offer support for any product. A true free market, which is only available by having open source code.
I don't compile my own anything anymore, except a few Perl modules. However, having the source available means that my RH8 boxes will continue
hurrah! (Score:5, Funny)
Dys damnlexia (Score:5, Funny)
Microsoft "retries"? (Score:3, Funny)
No, the first time around they used "abort" and "fail."
Fact: Windows 98 is dying (Score:5, Funny)
It is common knowledge that Windows 98 is dying. Everyone knows that ever hapless Windows 98 is mired in an irrecoverable and mortifying tangle of fatal trouble. It is perhaps anybody's guess as to which Windows 98 is the worst off of an admittedly suffering Windows 98 community. The numbers continue to decline for Windows but Windows 98 may be hurting the most. Look at the numbers. The erosion of user base for FreeBSD continues in a head spinning downward spiral.
All major marketing surveys show that Windows 98 has steadily declined in market share. Windows 98 is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If Windows 98 is to survive at all it will be among hobbyist dilettante dabblers. In truth, for all practical purposes Windows 98 is already dead. It is a dead man walking.
Fact: Windows 98 is dying
Heh.. you left a 'FreeBSD' in there ;) (Score:5, Funny)
He also forgot the last line: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Fact: Windows 98 is dying (Score:4, Insightful)
We wouldn't bother upgrading because they will be moving to a new building with a new network and everything two years, but the fact of the matter is that you can't set up a Windows 98 network, work through all the pain and pathetic Microsoft crap and then leave it alone once it works because it never stays working for long.
Microsoft may be abandoning the product but the fact of the matter is that they couldn't be bothered to make it not suck in the first place and there will be millions of people saddled with support this sorry piece of crap whether MS supports it or not.
If we were talking about Windows 2000 it would be a different story because Win2k was and continues to be a viable and stable platform. In fact, with the NT line, there hasn't been compelling reasons to upgrade for about 5 years except for support of new hardware. That's the problem... when you actually do something right, you lose the upgrade track because people are actually satisfied.
That's why MS never cared about the DOS branch of their OS's. They knew they would sell bazillions of copies, but when called on the carpet for its crappy quality, they could just point to the NT branch.
Now that those branches have merged, I guess they have to start making all their OS's suck, or run the risk of having too many satisfied customers.
Re:Fact: Windows 98 is dying (Score:5, Insightful)
As a matter of cost, having computer upgrades tied to building upgrades for an orgnization which Im sure has finite amounts of money is a Bad Thing. Either get your new hardware and licenses now, or after the new building: spread the costs around. Not for 30 years has physcially moving computers been a major cost concern. Computers are resonably portable. New computers and new buildings are sepearate issues.
Re:Fact: Windows 98 is dying (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Fact: Windows 98 is dying (Score:3, Informative)
But we were talking about win98, not internal security. (btw, most boxes have NO cd or floppy drive, on purpose). Internal security is the same for 98 as for nt or linux. I put my knoppix cd in ANY computer that can boot a cd, and I own it, 98 or not. Also, the most important part of internal security is not getting "socially engineered", which
Why is this news? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Why is this news? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Why is this news? (Score:5, Funny)
Microsoft BOB, after many years on top as the premier productivity assistant, is set to be retired. A Microsoft spokesman said: "We deeply regret the decision to end the life of such a successful product. However, a new breed of assistants, led by our popular 'Clippy' mascot will continue our fine tradition of assistive software." In response, user groups the world over have petitioned Microsoft to open-source BOB.
Re:Why is this news? (Score:3, Funny)
Like an idiot, I find them on his machine and drag them to his desktop.
Now it's either freestyle, porn, or travel reservations - I don't know that he's even opened any other applications, much less done any work.
Truly Sad..... (Score:4, Insightful)
Ironically, Win98se has been Microsoft's most secure operating system for the last two years!
Kuh-Bum-Boomp!
Thank you, I'll be here all week.
Fortunately ... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Truly Sad..... (Score:5, Informative)
Flamebait?
A Win98SE box runs no services. No DCOM, no RPC, no IIS, no "Remote Support", no MSN. With a couple of tweaks to rebind (or unbind) NetBIOS, it listens on no ports.
Use a third-party email client and a third-party browser to avoid the Outleak/IE holes, and the poster's right. For a clued-in user (i.e. someone smart enough not to click on every stupid attachment some bozo mails him), Win98SE is more secure than XP.
Is Win98 a good operating system? Hell no. It's a glorified DOS shell. Get your trojan running anywhere on that machine, and j00 0wn t3h b0x. But in order for that to happen, the end user pretty much has to cooperate.
Re:Truly Sad..... (Score:4, Interesting)
Furthermore, it would be easy to use XP or Windows 2000 with the firewall enabled. That would be as safe (or safer) than using the Windows 98 operating system. IE and Outlook are just disasters waiting to happen (on your system, on the internet they are already happening) so using third party browser and email client is to be recommended in all circumstances.
The only thing worse than using Windows 98 may be Windows ME, but they fixed some serious dial up issues in that operating system, blurring the choice a bit.
Re:Truly Sad..... (Score:5, Insightful)
While we're at it - Win9x was much more recoverable than NT/XP/2K. If an XP box dies on boot due to a fux0r3d registry, you reinstall because the "recovery console" doesn't actually let you run any executables that might help you "recover".
Win9x has a corrupt registry? No problem! Boot to DOS off a floppy. Add a line to MSDOS.SYS that that says BootGUI=0. Poke around in C:\WINDOWS\SYSBCKUP and find the last 4-5 versions of the registry. Extract somewhere safe, use ATTRIB to deprotect the corrupt registry, and overwrite.
CHKDSK/SCANDISK not cooperating? No problem in 9x. Boot to DOS and image the drive with Ghost before CHKDSK can corrupt anything.
Some twit's stupid installer overwrites MSVCRT.DLL with a borked version that breaks half your other applications? On XP, you're screwed - can't overwrite it 'cuz it's always in use. On 9x, boot to DOS and overwrite it yourself with a known "good" version. The same techniques apply to trivially expunge MS Outleak Excess and other borkware.
In this context, 9x is less secure than XP per se, but when the "security" you're trying to break is keeping you from manipulating files on your own bloody hard drive, sometimes that's a Good Thing.
Somewhere between NT and Longhorn, single-user machines that ran Microsoft operating systems ceased to be Your Computers and became Bill's Computers. Because it was based on DOS, a 98SE box is always going to be Your Computer.
Re:Truly Sad..... (Score:3, Insightful)
Hello LAST KNOWN GOOD CONFIGURATION.
I mean, it even detects failed boots and offers you the last known good config option automatically.
And any DLL necessary for booting is always in \dllcache, so some twit's stupid installer can't overwrite it.
You are either making stuff up or making your life more difficult than it needs to be.
Re:Truly Sad..... (Score:3, Funny)
Hollow victory (Score:5, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)
Just wait... (Score:5, Funny)
Nice way of spinning it (Score:5, Insightful)
for better? or for worse? (Score:5, Insightful)
1. force people to upgrade
1.1 forces people to spend money on something they may not need
1.2 forces people to use that windows activation thing
2. security. no more patches for win98. this means that the small group of people with win98 are always going to be vulnerable to internet viruses. Upgrade you say? what if you can't afford it?
i'm sure there are tons more reasons. in fact i'd like to heard more below but these are the two things that worry me because i have very little money and family/friends still using 98.
Re:for better? or for worse? (Score:4, Interesting)
The "activation thing" is a cripping feature. I can't accept that EULA in good faith, so I can't use XP at all (imo pirating XP would be sinking to MS's level). This just pushes me one step closer to a mac. I'm currently running win98 and win2k. The security issue is the major concern; now I can't use win98 on an important machine anymore.
Jason
ProfQuotes [profquotes.com]
Re:for better? or for worse? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:for better? or for worse? (Score:3, Insightful)
Au Contraire! I update my software I care about security and stability. I also do not pirate Microsoft software.
My Laptop and game
Re:for better? or for worse? (Score:4, Informative)
Similarly, tweaking DOSEMU and modifying Win98 (a la the modified Windows 3.1 of Win-OS/2, which can run in DOSEMU) would be fairly easy, since Win98 is architecturally so similar to DOS plus Win 3.1's 386 enhanced mode.
Mainstream OSS talent would be diverted into those projects and the improving Win98 projects, sure. But mainstream computer dollars would be lost by Microsoft to both a Linux that can run Win32 programs as well as XP, and a "Winux" that is Linux to the hardware and power users but modified and improved Win98 to the ordinary user and his software. (In the latter case, BSODs would still happen, but they'd cause the underlying Linux to quick-load another Windows session.)
I expect "Winux" would quickly become the favorite OS of computer makers; free and looks just like the familar Windows environment. Microsoft would lose hundreds of millions.
Still quite a few WIn 98 boxes out there (Score:5, Interesting)
I walked him through the process and told him that Win 98 support was going out the window at year's end. This isn't the first time this story has graced /.. He didn't seem to care and has no plans to upgrade until the hardware gives out and the harddrive fails or something like that.
Then he's buying a mac...
Uhh.... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Uhh.... (Score:5, Funny)
Available vs. Supported... (Score:5, Interesting)
Note that this says nothing about support for these products. Microsoft is going to stop distributing these products to comply with the court order, not support them. It really is two different issues.
Now, since some of these products aren't even sold anymore, the only reason this was noticed was because of the notice on MSDN, which is a place you could get these products if you had a subscription.
Long life to win98 (Score:5, Funny)
Long life to an OS which filled my life with the joy of rebooting, freezing and hardware failure blue screens (since the day of its presentation [cnn.com]).
It will be missed! :'-(
And what will MS do? (Score:4, Interesting)
They'll use retiring all those products to move people to a newer version of Windows, which will arguably be EVEN HARDER for users to migrate away from!
Every time Microsoft is sentenced to a "penalty" they find some way of using it to their advantage.
No reason why this will be any different.
this is our chance as well (Score:4, Insightful)
We need to take advantage of this, and convince people to get Linux and give it a try.
Tell them, if they like it and it does what you
need, then they won't have to upgrade.
But if it doesn't do what you need, they where going to have to upgrade anyways, right?
The Linux community does not get many opportunities like this. lets use it.
Headline misleading? (Score:3, Insightful)
This is misleading. As I understand the situation, they did NOT retire these packages because the court order told them too. They retired them because they did not want to get them into compliance and spend the resources on those packages. That is a big difference.
As with most MS settlements, they win even when they lose.
their lips moved (Score:4, Insightful)
Right, they had no intentions of improving or modifying W98SE. In fact, new sales must be so low it was time to shoot it anyway. So nice of them to blame Sun for what they obviously indended from the start. [slashdot.org] It's so much better than saying that 98 simply sucked, like they said about 95 and 3.1 and you get the picture. Oh wait, they did say that 98 sucks.
As with most MS settlements, they win even when they lose.
As with most Microsoft statements, it was a lie even when partially factual.
Passive Aggressive Legal/PR Strategy (Score:5, Insightful)
Compliance with court orders to remove the polluted versions of JVM does not [theregister.co.uk] require that those entire product lines be discontinued.
However, it is in Microsoft's business interest to push users of those products into upgrading to newer Microsoft products, for which they'll gain license revenue AND lower support costs associated with discontinuing support for those old products.
And, it is in MSFT's public relations interests to deflect blame for this action away from themselves and upon enemy Sun and its Java legal action.
Exactly the same red-herring strategy is being used to hold up class action settlements in California and to blame it on Lindows. [theregister.co.uk]
Noooo... (Score:5, Funny)
Why Copyright Laws Need Changing (Score:3, Interesting)
Win98 is still popular (Score:3, Informative)
Source:
http://www.google.com/press/zeitgeist.
Won't this make Win98 abandonware? -nt- (Score:3, Funny)
$699 to Sun... (Score:3, Funny)
So upgrading to Windows XP at only $500 a license will be a huge discount, plus you get a better OS! Even bigger savings if you have a multiprocessor!
Others Should be able to legally support it then. (Score:5, Insightful)
Car part companies won a major legal win where they were allowed to make parts, against the wishes of the car manufacturers because there was an over-riding consumer interest.
At what point must the publishers of a de-facto standard publish its source code to allow others to help the userbase when they choose not to?
Re:Others Should be able to legally support it the (Score:5, Funny)
1) Break your own legs in front of audiences. Every night.
2) Test new versions of salt and its ability to make paper cuts hurt.
3) Test the newest Windows UIs until your eyes bleed. Part time only; no one could do an eight-hour day.
4) Try to get Mobsters to pay protection money.
5) Become a mercenary and invade China. Alone.
6) Do an undercover report on how to get out of a Mexican Prison by doing so first hand.
Good luck!
Re:Others Should be able to legally support it the (Score:4, Insightful)
You actually own the car.
You don't own Win98. It's licensed to you by M$.
As the owner of my car, it's my choice what parts I want to be in it (within reason of course).
As the owner of Win98, it's their choice whether they want to offer support.
Go FreeBSD.
Re:Others Should be able to legally support it the (Score:3, Interesting)
Let me put this as politely as I can: bullshit!
I don't own the copyright to Windows, but I damned well own my copy of it and the CD it came on. The software industry pretends otherwise, but the reality says differently. The only reason why they've gotten away with it is because the courts have ignored the situation.
When you walk into a store, pick up a box that says "Windows XP", see a price tag that says "$199", walk to the sales counter, hand over $199 p
Alas poor 98, (Score:3, Interesting)
That make me wonder about Windows TCO (Score:4, Interesting)
I wonder if any of those TCO papers discuss what it costs to upgrade in the next ten years because MS decides to put something in their software to make you upgrade.
Should I miss it? (Score:3, Interesting)
I'm not sure how I should react to this.
But personally, my vote is for Windows 95b. The b is very important. That was a distribution that actually worked. If they kept the USB add-ons available I might still have on of my machines running it.
I wonder how Windows 95b would run on a 3GHz CPU with 1GB RAM?
Re:Should I miss it? (Score:3, Informative)
I wouldn't - above a certain speed Win9x falls over with a division by zero (some kind of busy loop it uses for timing I think).
IIRC it can only address 256MB anyway without becoming unstable.
/not/ court-ordered (Score:3, Informative)
Too bad... (Score:3, Funny)
Truly an American Icon (Score:5, Funny)
Disastrous (Score:3, Interesting)
This is utterly disastrous. Companies that say there are risks of working with Linux should see what it means to work with Sun.
--Dan
one advantage to Win98 you missed (Score:3, Interesting)
The funny thing is, I'm also running Zonealarm and a private FW, but it's nice to know the next time some mega XP worm launches it won't affect me too badly...
RB
Final Security Patches Released for Windows 98 (Score:3, Informative)
In the name of security (Score:3, Insightful)
Interesting, that could be a valid point. What is the turn-around for SUN on security issues? I'm sure there must be some, but I've never heard of them. Certainly not the weekly holes and patches that seem to be released for your basic Microsoft applications.
What the judge said is that they had to use SUN's one-true-Java. Rather then change their applications to use the standard SUN Java, they decided to scrap them. Litigation took so long that some of these programs are close to their end of life anyway. How Childish.
Should be Win Me, not 98 (Score:3, Informative)
IMO the damned thing is so twitchy and unstable it should never have been released, whereas 98 by comparison just keeps on going, just like NT4 SP6a which I believe to be far more stable than either 2K or XP.
Nooooooo (Score:3, Informative)
Thats a damn shame they had to stop supporting it. How many people stil use it? I know of a few and i think i'd rather use it thanx XP, but then, i'd rather use linux than anything else.
Re:Good, now retire IE5 (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Good, now retire IE5 (Score:4, Informative)
> Office XP Developer
> Visio 2000
> BackOffice Server 2000
> Office 2000 Developer
> Office 2000 Tools
> Office 2000 Multilingual
> Office 2000 Premium SR-1
> Office 2000 Service Pack 2
> Outlook 2000
> Project 2000
> SQL Server 7
> SQL Server 7 Service Pack 3
> Embedded Visual Tools 3.0
> Visual Studio 6 MSDE
> IE 5.5
> MapPoint 2002
> Visual Studio 6.0 SP3 and SP5
> Windows 98
> Windows 98 Y2K
> Windows 98 Resource Kit
> Windows 98 SP1 (all win98 except SE)
> Windows NT 4.0 (Terminal Server and Option Pack)
> ISA Server 2000
> Visual Basic for (Alpha Systems)
>
> The following products will be updated to versions that do not contain the
> Microsoft Virtual Machine:
>
> Office XP Professional with FrontPage
> Publisher 2002
> Windows NT 4.0 (Workstation, Server, Enterprise Server)
> Small Business Server 2000
No, it does not include Win98 SE (Score:5, Informative)
Due to a settlement agreement reached in January 2001, the following products are being phased out and will no longer available to customers through MSDN Subscriber Downloads or other channels at Microsoft. These products will be removed from MSDN Subscriber Downloads as of December 15th, 2003.
Office XP DeveloperVisio 2000
BackOffice Server 2000
Office 2000 Developer
Office 2000 Tools
Office 2000 Multilingual
Office 2000 Premium SR-1
Office 2000 Service Pack 2
Outlook 2000
Project 2000
SQL Server 7
SQL Server 7 Service Pack 3
Embedded Visual Tools 3.0
Visual Studio 6 MSDE
IE 5.5
MapPoint 2002
Visual Studio 6.0 SP3 and SP5
Windows 98
Windows 98 Y2K
Windows 98 Resource Kit
Windows 98 SP1 (all win98 except SE)
Windows NT 4.0
ISA Server 2000
Visual Basic for (Alpha Systems)
The following product will be updated with Java-compliant versions before the 12/31/03 deadline: Office XP Professional with FrontPage
Publisher 2002
Windows NT 4.0
Small Business Server 2000
Re:No, it does not include Win98 SE (Score:3, Insightful)
Office XP Developer
Visio 2000
BackOffice Server 2000
Office 2000 Developer
Office 2000 Tools
Office 2000 Multilingual
Office 2000 Premium SR-1
Office 2000 Service Pack 2
Outlook 2000
Project 2000
Are they saying the JVM is in all these products ?
Most likely it is they want to force people to upgrade to the latest products.
I wont even contemplate how SQL server impinges on JVM
I guess I am in the cynical camp and see this as a marketting ploy to force people
Woo Hoo! Safe again! (Score:4, Funny)
SAFE AGAIN!!
Re:Harsh assessment? (Score:3, Interesting)
CNET is owned by Paul Allen's Vulcan Northwest [cjr.org]. Paul Allen has a 5% stake in Microsoft.
Tin foil, get your tin foil!
Re:Harsh assessment? (Score:3, Funny)
If you are not already wearing your tin foil hat then you have already been compromised...
Re:Friends, Netizens, Slashdotters (Score:3, Insightful)
For example, if you want DirectX9 (which originally wasn't supposed to be available for Win98) borrow a friends' copy of Flight Sim 2004, and run the DirextX9 install. Heck, if you search enough old game CDs, you'll find all sorts of updates and patches, including IE5.5 for Win95, and the Win95 USB backpatches.
Remember, game developers ha
Re:Things I wish Microsoft would retire (Score:5, Insightful)
*aHeM* Netscape, pre-Microsoft-killing, was not anywhere near being standard. The last version of Netscape that supported the standards properly was probably Netscape 3.01. After that they too tried to pull Microsofts game on Microsoft, embrace/extend/etc. However Microsoft ultimately won due to the tight grip on the desktop.