Commodore BBSes Return using the Internet. 261
oldbitcollector writes "Several Commodore 64 enthusiasts have developed a method for putting Commodore BBS sytems on the Internet. Users can "dial" using a standard 64 connected to the Internet or by using a "CG Term" for the PC. Details can be found here."
What? (Score:5, Funny)
Doing same on Vic20 (Score:5, Interesting)
Intrestingly enough I wasn't supprised to discovere I had no callers. I was only supprised as to WHY)
If the trick is handled all on the PC side (and I expect it is) then it dosen't matter.
If they are doing it the way I think
(Commodore userport to RS232 to null modem to PC sereal (rs232) then PC forwards to telnet etc...) this should also work on the Vic20.
For that matter it should also work for CP/M, Apple II, TSR-80. Pritty much any old BBS.
Dos BBSes can be done on the same Linux or Windows box that provides the Internet access making it much easier.
Re:Doing same on Vic20 (Score:3, Informative)
You think that's bad... (Score:2)
6502 Assembly (Score:2, Funny)
Oh boy! (Score:5, Funny)
Hip hip Horray!
Re:Oh boy! (Score:2, Funny)
System admins, for some reason, are not paying much attention to this latest threat.....
Re:Oh boy! (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Oh boy! (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Oh boy! (Score:2)
Yeah, it's sure good to know that things haven't changed as far as underpowered computers connecting on the Internet...makes me want to hook my fishbowl to it
Weird (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Weird (Score:4, Funny)
.
Re:Weird (Score:3, Interesting)
Commodore BBSs were such fun for cracker sysops. Since they stored user passwords in the clear for any sysop to read, once you had sysop access on two different popular BBSs, you could tell who used the same password on all their accounts everywhere.
Once upon a time, there was even a BBS owner/sysop I knew who didn't bother to use more than one password.
Need I say more?
Re:Weird (Score:4, Insightful)
True, but what could you gain access to with other people's passwords at the time? Another commodore BBS? Getting a chance to cheat in an online game? Posting as this person, "I am a foofoo head because I use the same password everywhere!" Once upon a time, passwords were pretty damn worthless.
setting low expecations (Score:5, Funny)
Re:setting low expecations (Score:3, Informative)
Re:setting low expecations (Score:2)
Re:setting low expecations (Score:2)
Re:setting low expecations (Score:2)
And I criticized MSIE for this years before I'd heard of OSS. This isn't zealout MS bashing, it's an expert (7 years web development) opinion.
Re:setting low expecations (Score:2, Insightful)
For the most part forgetting a tag or here there while violating the almighty standard really poses no huge problems. What pisses me off is the demand for huge graphics, flash, sounds, ActiveX, etc...
Seems people can't express what they want to say so they make up scores of useless animations that don't say anything.... for them!
Tom
Re:setting low expecations (Score:2)
Well, that would eliminate many [w3.org]* sites [w3.org]. In fact, there'd probably be only two sites left on the whole i-net.
* No wonder it is blocked; they get failing remarks for their "master development" skillz:
File: Slashdot.htm
Doctype:
Encoding:
I was not able to extract a character encoding labeling from any of the valid sources for such information. Without encoding information it is impossible to validate the document. The sourc
Re:setting low expecations (Score:2)
modems (Score:5, Funny)
Re:modems (Score:5, Funny)
Sorry to burst your little bubble, but us broadbanders can also connect to these BBS'es using CGTerm [paradroid.net], as mentioned in the article.
Guess you'll have to make do with A-HA and Duran Duran albums for that exclusive sense nostalgia ... oh wait, I have those too :P
Re:modems (Score:2)
Hey, but the guy some slack. He's still trying to download the article on his 56k modem...
Re:modems (Score:3, Funny)
Re:modems (Score:2)
I didn't know 110bps modems could double has snow boots...
Re:modems (Score:2)
Acoustic modems indeed could double as snowboots if you really wanted. Wrap the db-25 cable around your feet and you have little suction cups for those ice patches.
I suspect the baudot modem was less practical for this application however.
Very nice, but... (Score:3, Interesting)
(This isn't intended as a troll or flamebait... it's a genuine question....)
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:4, Funny)
When you log on, check out the Uploads/New!!0-3Decades/ folder for all the latest stuff
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:2)
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:5, Informative)
But yes, there are various different expansions available, including hard drives and more memory. There were various 3rd-party options, and now someone has developed a way to hook up an IDE drive to a C64 [volny.cz]. It also can be used to access CF cards.
I believe that apps had to support the memory upgrade peripherals. I seem to recall them being fairly popular with GEOS users.
The 1581 drive had 790K (Score:2, Interesting)
Was I the ONLY kid on the block who had one of those drives?
Back in the old days I bragged about having a combined storage of 1.5 megabytes online! lol. Man, now I have 2 terabytes on 2 networked PCs...
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:2)
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:3, Informative)
I still have a couple of SFDs in my basement. 4,133 blocks free each, a hair over a meg. My 8050, bless it's soul, blew up in the early nineties. (8050 - two side-by-side single-sided SFDs in a 4040 chassis).
I also have a couple of 4040 chassis lying around intact (except for repairs -- they work), and one which was stuffed full of single-speed Sony CD-ROMs many many moons ago.
For the parent, The 1541 had 664 blocks free, or about 170K of usable storage. Unless you chose to use track 18 (th
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:3, Interesting)
Actually, IIRC the 1541 was single-sided
But if you got some scissors and cut little rectangle shaped holes in the appropriate place, you could make the disks themselves double sided. You'd still have to turn them over though, yeah.
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:3, Informative)
The 1541 held a massive 170kB (per side; disk had to be flipped manually) and transfered data at a blazing 400 bytes per second.
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:5, Interesting)
We even had to renumber the BASIC line numbers, because they were stores as strings. Many calls to "GOSUB 55000" took up way too much so we did silly things like change that to "GOSUB 3", then line 3 said "goto 55000" Woo hoo! we recovered 200 bytes!
As the BASIC program grew we ran out of memory and started re-writing bits of it in 6502 assembler. We had bits of machine code stuck in unusual places like the cassette drive buffer, ram under the basic ROM, unused ram between the basic ROM and the OS rom, on the screen RAM, you name it.
You'd load up the program, then swap the floopy, putting in your "download section" disk. Hey, good programs where 32K back then
Later some company made a proprietary SCSI controller and a 10MB external hard drive. I had two of them for a while. Yup, a C64 with 20MB downwload section.
I also ran the BBS list for Toronto Computes!, and had a monthly column on BBSing that I wrote between 1985-1995. I was a big supporter of the BBS scene back them.
- James.
You deserve a "Thanks!" (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:3, Funny)
Actually, it's a very secure system to go on the internet with, for one thing: even the smallest Windows virus won't fit in 32K.
Correction. (Score:5, Informative)
Not quite true. One counterexample: Win32.Driller, a memory-resident virus which is 8K in size.
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:2)
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:3, Informative)
It's actually 64 K of RAM about 51 k of it usable. Most Commodore BBSs swap in and out the various sub-programs as needed.
and about an 800K floppy
Most BBS sysops have a hard drive or large RAM drive such as the CMD Hard Drive or RAMLink [cmdrkey.com] I started with floppies (which the 5.25" drives were 170 k and the more expensive 3.5" were 800k) but you can only run a text based board (and not a networked one) on such limited capacity.
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:2)
Ummm... I know for a fact you could get mass storage for the C64. They were sold in computer stores in the form of a 10 or 20meg peripheral which was nothing more then a scsi host adapter, and often times an MFM/RLL to SCSI controler. The cooler ones could support 2 MFM drives...I know I bought my 15meg Seagate st-419 in about 1988 for about $300.
I can speak only from the atari standpoint as far as 8bits with mass storage.
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:2)
(*) Some, of course (like the memory used to hold what's displayed on the screen) has fixed use, but most can be used generally.
Re:Very nice, but... (Score:2)
Even 'back in the day' there was mass storage for Commodore 64s. My father taught computer studies at a local high school, and part of his job was managing a network of--if memory serves--sixty or so Commodore 64s.
The Commodore 9060 and 9090 offered 6.4 and 9.6 MB [commodore.ca] of storage, respectively. Manual here [commodore.ca], for anyo
But the question i'm asking is... (Score:2, Funny)
are they "secure" like the old bbs' were?
everyone knows that a bbs attracts conspiratist theorists like flies to fido spread over 5km of freewayBut do they have a place for .... (Score:2)
Actually it'd be interesting if some of the old databases of messages could be restored.... as BBSs carried local events and interesting conversation.... you know before we knew first hand what trolls and flamers were or would become...
Re:But do they have a place for .... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:But do they have a place for .... (Score:2)
Hey, you know that is a good idea. As a kid calling BBSs, I really think that the opportunity to communicate with older folks helped me a lot from a maturity/learning/thinking/etc standpoint. It is sad that today it seems like the Internet only causes trouble for younger kids- the sexual predators and stuff. BBSs were a much tighter community, at least in the small town where I grew up. Even if you didn't know the
Wow, this brings back memories (Score:5, Interesting)
One thing I really miss from those days is the sense of community, and the games. I ran a number of games on my BBS, and it was always a lot of fun watching people interact. Unlike modern online games, anyone could write a test-oriented BBS game if they knew a little BASIC, so there were all sorts of cool games. I remember in particular a drag racing game where you could race, earn money, buy upgrades, and compete against other drivers (i.e. other players on the same BBS). The integration of the game into real-time was fascinating -- most BBS games let you make a limited number of moves a day, so people would play a single session of a game for _weeks_. And there were tons of cool timing tricks, like dialing into the BBS at 11:30 so that you'd have the last move before midnight and then the first game after midnight, which could give you a nice advantage (and leave you vulnerable as everyone else moves after you).
Hey, thanks for the excuse for the flashback. Fun days!
Re:Wow, this brings back memories (Score:2)
Citadel's had this amazing networking scheme where BBS's could route messages between them so that (like Fido) you could send email (slowly) cross-country with only a series of local phone calls (i.e. free). But it was about a billion times easier to set up, as you simple created a shared room and configured w
Citadels were the best! (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Wow, this brings back memories (Score:2)
Hardly amusing. The technique of offloading CPU load onto specialized, more powerful (in their own way) specialized coprocessors is older than the ST. Hell, even the blitter could be said to be faster than the 68K in the ST.
Have you ever wondered what part of your PC does floating-point calculations the fastest? and which one does DSP the fastest? (hint: it's not the main CPU).
Re:Wow, this brings back memories (Score:2)
Check out these links.
http://archives.thebbs.org [thebbs.org]
and
http://bbslist.textfiles.com [textfiles.com]
Don't forget to google for Similar pages, if you migrated to PC after the Apple/C64 classic modem BBS'ing, you can find all the Ansi Door games of the past. BTW, you can run door games under linux with dosemu and Linux BBS software for those broadband Tradewar junkies.
Ahh the memorys (Score:2, Interesting)
First BBS I logged into was a DYM BBS.. I was too young to log in and I lied.
It didn't work out.
Then I logged into the Forth BBS in SanFransisco. Your command prompt was actually in forth.
The way forth works is you can add commands so the BBS fuctions were just new commands. I think they locked off the programming features (makes sense but I never tried to edit the BBS so I don't know).
I remeber the ongoing story of Murphy Law of folly forth. I just folowed the story as it progressed. "Folow the yell
SWEET JESUS. (Score:5, Funny)
In case of slashdotting.... (Score:2)
Here's the link in case it gets slashdotted...
last stand bbs minneapolis, mn
Connecting...
CONNECTED TO A CENTIPEDE BBS SYSTEM!
HIT RETURN
Re:SWEET JESUS. (Score:5, Funny)
and it's as easy... (Score:2)
who knew?
Feels Different (Score:5, Funny)
Vic20 users have rights too, dammit!!! (Score:2)
--
Mad Penguin [madpenguin.org]
This is the future of the innurnet! (Score:2, Funny)
another day at the k mart (Score:4, Funny)
20 PRINT "YOU"
30 GOTO 10
END
Re:another day at the k mart (Score:2)
I was the teacher's pet but he never caught me and he was always REALLY pissed when it went off.
Sad, aren't I?
Re:another day at the k mart (Score:5, Funny)
There was also a network printer; it even beeped if you sent it a ^G.
So one afternoon, we carefully crafted up a file full of ^G's and pagefeeds (^L), queue'd the file about a hundred times while the printer was turned off, and went to our next class. Since the network didn't have any kind of 'queue management', nobody had any idea what the problem was and after chewing through about half a box of paper, the printer got sent back to the shop for servicing.
Good times..
While it seems kinda funny... (Score:2, Funny)
I'm all for nostalgia in some minor way but when do you let it rest? I wonder how many guys are out there praising this move who, the day after they got their x86, were trashing the C=64?
I still own a working Amiga but even I've come to the point that I'm asking myself; what for? It was great in the day but the day's over. Stop playing Trade Wars and play some MOH so I have another newb I can kick in the nuts...
Re:While it seems kinda funny... (Score:2)
The dreams in which I'm dying are the best I've ever had.
Yup, it sure is a very very mad world.
BBSmates.com (Score:5, Informative)
(And there're a lot of old BBSes available through telnet, though I dunno about C64-based ones.)
Whoa flashbacks. (Score:3, Interesting)
GOOGOOACKACKBADBAD
Punter
Xmodem-1K and Ymodem-1K
300 Baud modems you pluged your sound into.
Sixpack (s2g), Arj, Lha
4 pixel wide 80 column display on a 40 column terminal
4 color ansi (And of course Petascii)
Burping Number 5.
Dual Sid, playing Skate or Die, Sids rule
Speedload Cartridges, (My fav the Snapshot)
GEOS and Quantumlink
Peek and Poke
Compiled Basic
Atari 2600 joysticks
Am I missing anything else? Other than almost every BBS being written in compiled basic, some where written in C. The Amiga where BBS's compiled in C was the rave. Moving on UP. I remember before I got my Amiga, I upgraded to a C128 so I could do real 80 column ANSI, for almost a year during school, I had at least a real ANSI term, DesTerm I recall, even had real zmodem.
Rusty and Eddies!
Ok, I should stop now before I go on about moving to PC playing Tradewars on WWIV BBS's and Galaciticom (Before they turned into ISP software.)
The BBS scene has turned into the IRC scene, now it seems to be the IM scene. Blogs are there too, but I was blogging before it was blogs, so Im blogged out. (Or is Slashdot a BLOG?)
"Know your roots!"
Maybe it's just me... (Score:4, Interesting)
AT&F&C1&D2
terminal server (Score:2)
Remember when the PCers were running multiple copies of their software under Desqview, for a multiline system on one machine? I wonder if you could accomplish the same thing with multiple instances of [insert old computer here] running on your favorite modern OS? Probably lots of file locking (or lack thereof) problems to overcome, though.
I ran a board for years--taught me a lot, especially about mode
Commodore Like BBS on BSD (Score:3, Informative)
It's been a fun project and we hope to continue it's development whenever spare time is available.
Door games? (Score:2)
Does this mean I can play Hack & Slash again? At least this time around I don't have to worry about whether the ultra-fast 14400 line is available...
-JemBut... (Score:2)
Re:But... (Score:2, Funny)
(I called my character A RED DOOR TO THE NORTH)
> Open red door
I DO NOT SEE A RED DOOR HERE.
A RED DOOR TO THE NORTH STRIKES YOU, INFLICTING 30 DAMAGE.
(I also liked to call my character "1l1l1lll11")
Anyone want to do the same for Apple ]['s? (Score:2)
Ah, memories... (Score:2, Interesting)
I remember my C=64 with fondness. I should, I paid $495 or so...
There was a guy I found who was building 1 meg of RAM expansion slots, I thought I was on top of the world. And when i got my 3.5" 1.44 Mb floppy drive I almost peed my pants.
I forget the program, but I set up my C=64 to be a BBS for the real estate office I worked in. You could NOT tell you weren't on a PC (286/386) of the period.
I wrote my first book on that machine, printed it out on a Star printer, and published it.
And there WERE a few BBS
Re:Ah, memories... (Score:2)
Re:Ah, memories... (Score:5, Funny)
They later moved to the PC market and changed their name to America On-Line. I hear they might still be in business.
History Lesson (Score:3, Interesting)
Commodore was unbelievably stupid, and made some things harder for programmers. For example, the C-64 and C-128 computers both had a software-emulated UART chip, instead of a real one (to save money, as I understand it, about $5), limiting the baud rate to how fast the computer could process code in what was called a "non-maskable interrupt". The C-64 allowed a max of 1200 baud. The C-128, because it could run at double the clock speed of the C-64 ("Fast Mode", or about 2Mhz), could in theory run at 2400 baud, but you had to write your own version of the UART emulator using well-optimized machine language. Faster connection speeds were out of the question.
As the author of a few C-64 programs (e.g., "Prototerm"), I can't tell you how many times I wanted to drive to West Chester, and strangle someone. Nowadays, of course, I periodically get the urge to strangle a person or two in Redmond. Fortunately, it's too long a drive.
Nothing every changes, just the names and faces.
Accurate History (Score:3, Informative)
slashdotted? (Score:3, Funny)
LOAD "HTTP://WWW./PETSCII.COM/",8,1
HTTP 404 SITE NOT FOUND
READY
so anyway, I just had to add this little bit to get aroung the lameness filter. So, how's that Internet thing doing?
To be realistic (Score:3, Informative)
Why Commodore BBSes ruled. (Score:3, Interesting)
The thing I liked the most about Commodore BBSes was the color and graphics. Every BBS had little custom color schemes and graphical flourishes here and there. And, of course, the phreakers' boards had the most flamboyant designs. With the popularity of ASCII art today, you can just imagine what Commodore users could accomplish with PETSCII, and what Atari users could accomplish with ATASCII now that you mention it.
Color64 and C-net boards had a charm that was hard to match.
Re:Why Commodore BBSes ruled. (Score:2)
A lot of the color stuff lives on in the IRC Undernet though. The first time I saw Undernet I just started laughing. It certainly gets your attention!
Waxing nostalgic about Commodore BBS's... (Score:4, Interesting)
One of my dad's coworker friends ran a board called "The Ivory Tower", and passed the info along to me. Let me tell ya, up until that time, I had no idea how my life was going to change. I miss the small community feel of old BBS's like "The Ivory Tower".
I remember also the frustration of hearing those blasted 'busy' signals when trying to call up a popular board. As I made my way around the various BBS's of Knoxville, TN, I came across "The Volunteer BBS" -- it was one of my favorite hang-outs -- it was a PC based BBS, but they had great online games like Millway's Casino and Tradewars 2002. With the Internet being so global, it's getting harder to find such cozy little places to hang out anymore.
Bring back Millway's Casino!
What it needs to make it really authentic... (Score:3, Interesting)
W E L C O M E
T O
T H E
C O M M O D O R E
P I R A T E 'S D E N
1> Warez 2>Chat 3>BBS System
>?
Forget Internet; drop back to dial-up BBS (Score:2, Interesting)
Well, BBS systems are making a general come back.. (Score:2)
Whoa... memories... (Score:2)
It lead more-or-less on a straight road to writing GemStone I, ][ and III, and thus the company I now run. But to see someone record that FRPBBS existed, brings a tear to my eye.
Yeah... we all have slashdot
Re:uhh (Score:2)
Re:Revolutionary (Score:4, Insightful)
Just because it's old doesn't mean it's not useful!
Re:Revolutionary (Score:5, Insightful)
Where we've been determines where we're going. "Those who don't pay attention to history are doomed to repeat it" and all that. Use that machine, so you can see why things developed the way they did - maybe you'll avoid some of the miskates made prior to you.
That 33/66 you have contains half of the reasons things are the way they are now. Your new Athlon64 can run DOS, after all, just like the old stuff. Study the older machines, friend, they'll show you much about today's "new" technology.
Soko
Re:Revolutionary (Score:2, Interesting)
Apple IIgs? (Score:4, Interesting)
But I haven't heard of any earlier Apple IIs being accessible via Telnet, and not any `GBBS "Pro"' systems.
Re:Apple IIgs? (Score:2, Informative)
For a goot Old School BBS, you could always try : it's been running for 18-19 years now. You can connect using telnet or phone lines, just like in the old days. This BBS fulfilled by computer addiction when I went offline (not enough money) for 6 months, 2 years ago. Glad it's still there, just in case.
Getting old systems on the net... (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Q-link! AOL! (Score:2)