A Software Project Full of "Male Anatomy" Jokes Causes Controversy 765
An anonymous reader writes with the story of a Github user's joke repository that is causing some controversy. "There's no question that the tech world is an overwhelmingly male place. There's legit concern that tech is run-amok with 'brogrammers' that make women programmers feel unwelcome. On the other hand, people just want to laugh. It's at that intersection that programmer Randy Hunt, aka 'letsgetrandy' posted a 'project' earlier this week to software hosting site GitHub called 'DICSS.' The project, which is actual free and open source software, is surrounded by geeky jokes about the male anatomy. And it's gone nuts, so to speak, becoming the most trending project on Github, and the subject of a lot of chatter on Twitter. And, Hunt tells us, the folks at Github are scratching their heads wondering what they should do about it. Some people love DICSS ... and some people are, understandably, offended. The offended people point out that this is exactly the sort of thing that makes tech unwelcoming to women, and not just because of the original project, but because of some of the comments (posted as "commits") that might take the joke too far."
Normal women... (Score:5, Funny)
Actually find the male anatomy to be hilarious...
Re:Normal women... (Score:5, Insightful)
Basically what is happening here is that anything remotely male specific in the workplace is being banned because some hugely overly sensitive person with neurotic tendencies (and no, it does not have to be a woman) might potentially get offended - even silently or potentially. So even if no one has said anything or there is no obvious actual problem, then action MUST be taken at all costs.
So the answer is to corporate-speak style whitewash everything in existence and berate any man for ever having an opinion on any subject ever.
Yes, I am being tongue in cheek here to some extent but there is a sensible limit somewhere to all this...
Re:Normal women... (Score:5, Insightful)
Which is actually Article II of the Bill of No Rights [friesian.com].
Re:Normal women... (Score:5, Insightful)
Is anyone actually offended? TFA doesn't mention any specific people who claim to be, just that the project might be controversial. Might be... Looks like click bait, a manufactured controversy where there is none.
Re:Animal House (Score:5, Insightful)
There is no right to create a hostile working environment for women.
A 'random' github repository isn't a hostile working environment. For that matter, why do we automatically assume that sexual jokes are 'hostile' towards women? Even when they're for anatomy that women typically don't have?
Why do we assume that women don't have a sense of humor and men aren't offended, apparently, by anything?
Many of the women I've worked with are just fine with a certain amount of humor. Dick jokes all day would get boring quickly, but if you have a 'joke of the day' board that pulls from a list of jokes that include everything from 'why'd the chicken cross the road' to 'your mama' to George Carlin thoughts, to 'How NOT to get your ass beat by the police', and containing about 1% jokes that can be considered sexual, is 3-4 sexual jokes a year creating a hostile environment? Or perhaps I should say, would preventing those 3-4 jokes a year going to create a more hostile environment?
As for your frat house arms race - yeah, that's going overboard, ala my 'dick jokes all day' example. Extremism is bad, everything in moderation(including moderation).
Re:Animal House (Score:5, Insightful)
2. drive away women and socially normal programmers
You're assuming both women and 'socially normal programmers' don't enjoy the occasional dick joke. Which is my second paragraph.
1. suppress the toxic, asocial frat boy douchebaggery
You're also assuming that a repository of dick jokes is automatically toxic.
Re: (Score:3)
a strawman is an off-topic unrelated issue
Actually, a straw man fallacy consists of portraying an opposing argument in an incorrect manner, usually missing important details or appearing overly general, and then implying that the original argument has been fully disproved.
just the other day i went up to a group of females and started telling dick jokes
This is actually an example of a straw man fallacy, because however unsavory you find it to be that Firethorn thinks people might actually enjoy penis jokes, he did not advocate that there is never an inappropriate context. Your statement contrives what is probably one of the cle
Re:Animal House (Score:4, Insightful)
So because of this one project suddenly the whole repo is unusable or the whole idea of OSS is untenable?
(facepalm)
if you leave a bag of chocolate in a room and it's empty in 10 seconds, what have you learned?
is it safe to assume the people in the room like chocolate?
do you understand that?
now:
if this socially moronic project rockets to the top in popularity on GitHub, what have you learned about the prevailing culture?
you tell me
Re:Animal House (Score:5, Insightful)
if this socially moronic project rockets to the top in popularity on GitHub, what have you learned about the prevailing culture?
you tell me
You have learned that your point of view is not as popular as you thought it was. You may want to re-examine your definition of "socially moronic".
Re:Animal House (Score:4)
if this socially moronic project rockets to the top in popularity on GitHub, what have you learned about the prevailing culture?
That people want to see what all of the controversy is about?
Look, the Internet has actual pornography on it, and I'm told it is very popular. But do you have to look at it if you do not like it? No, you do not. Same goes for the DICSS project. You can go your entire programming life without actually looking at the DICSS project.
Indeed, I intend to go my entire programming life without looking at the DICSS project. I did not click the link, and I am not going to. And it's not because I'm offended by dicks or dick jokes. It's because my sense of humor has changed a bit since middle school, and I just don't see any reason to bother.
Re:Animal House (Score:5, Insightful)
and to not admit that, to try to deflect that, like you are, is a clumsy, unsuccessful attempt at avoiding the obvious
That you're an ivory tower type trying to find something to feel superior about? That you get to look down on society because *sniff*, it's so crude? That you can't deal with sexual humor?
I'm not calling it high art, obviously. But humor is humor, and part of humor is being inappropriate at times.
I should probably rephrase my point a bit to make it clearer. There are lots of serious repositories out there. The people working on said repositories spend lots of time there. Somehow the 'dick joke' one goes viral(see 'slashdot effect'), and you end up with lots and lots of people signing into said repository to see what's up, even if they only spend 5 minutes on it.
Re: (Score:3)
yes, "i was just joking" is the standard go-to cover story for socially immature douchebags when they realize they have been inappropriate or transgressive or pathetic. thanks for demonstrating that
Again with the Strawman. Where in my post did I suggest that I was joking? I might be talking about humor, but I'm being serious. Well, other than my picturing you as a cloistered noble getting the vapors, covering your nose with a handkerchief.
Re: (Score:3)
when you haven't even tried to understand the simple fucking point of what someone said.
Oh, I recognize the point. I just think it's irrelevant, because like I said before 'Hallo! I'm over HERE!'. You're normally so off course that if we were on a firing range you'd be practicing excellent muzzle control keeping it downrange and away from me at all times.
if you actually thought about what i was writing, it would lead you to realize there isn't a strawman in anything i said
I accurately identified and noted the strawmen. Sounds like you need a few English courses as well. Tell me, have you read the wiki I linked to yet? Even re-read the argument stream I called strawman on you for? I explained most of them
Re:Animal House (Score:5, Interesting)
There is no right to create a hostile working environment for women.
I remember a workplace turned into a nightmare for men - at least the normal guys. The guys everyone knew harassed women? not a change.
After being told that "Whatever a woman considers Sexual Harassment is sexual harassment turned the workplace into one where men avoided women at all costs, had witnesses to protect themselves, and made the US-Russia cold war look like a honeymoon, What manner of workplace was that?
All came to a head one day, when HR came down to tell a machinist he had to remove the photo of a cheerleader he posted on his toolbox. Apparently it was offensive to some women.
He refused. Was that sexually objectifying women, and therefore offensive?
It was his daughter, who was a cherleader in high school.
Now as apocryphal as that sounds, it did happen. And a not too long later, they made the harassment guidlelines much more realistic. Apparently most of the women really hated them as well. THey had interesting commentary on the women who were originally in charge of the program, one that you might think only evil men would make. But even that is telling.
This is why blanket statements as "creating a hostile work environment for women" is so broad as to be unworkable. Two of my friends at work were the dirtiest minded, crude sexual innuendo joke telling women I've ever had the pleasure of knowing. Both found the draconian regulations very very uncomfortable. And if you thik that seeing a acronym makes for a hostile work environment, try working in a place where everone is scared shitless of you, finding you the equivalent of a hand grenade with the pin already pulled.
So what you are really saying is that we should not be allowed to make the workplace hostile to women who are offended by any mention of sex. It's really catering to the thinnist skinned individuals when you make acronyms illegal. There is a fundamental problem of catering to the lowest denominator.
I wonder if we should make the workplace less hostile to Muslim men who are offended by seeing women not in Burkhas? Are they not just as offended and is it not about sex?
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She gave me a rather nasty look and said: "No. ANYTHING I find offensive is sexual harassment."
I've met a few. Severe anger and dominance issues, and sexual harassment is the tool they use to bludgeon others with. Sexual harassment is their hammer, and everything is a nail that needs hammered.
And there are all kinds of people you meet in life. THer eare certainly men posting in here that are the same as the women they hate, only difference is the gender, all the other issues the same.
But what we have to do as rational people is decide who to pay attention to. I'm not certain it's all that smart t
Re: (Score:3)
Re:Animal House (Score:5, Informative)
There is no right to create a hostile working environment for women.
Someone's personal non-employer-owned git repo on the internet is not a working environment.
It's only a working environment if you pull the code into a professional software development project and then incrorporate the inappropriate comments into a codebase where both yourself and coworkers or employers have access to it as part of the working arrangement.
Hostile? Agreed, bad idea. (Score:5, Insightful)
What you want is an environment that is hostile to men. Offended by this project? WTF are you doing nosing around the project? Offended by strippers? WTF are you doing nosing around strip clubs and the like? Offended by foul language? Why are you listening? Offended by... well, you get the idea. You don't like something, don't pay money for it, don't support it, don't publicize it, don't bother with it, etc. Find something you DO support and do something you find to be positive. Otherwise, yes, you're going to be offended, and it's your own stupid fault.
Until someone messes with your wallet, your person, your reputation, your family in like manner, or your property, your right to exert control ends on property you have control of (which usually means you own or rent it.) Other than that, you can say anything you want, anywhere you want but on property others rent or own where you are not, and should not be, in control, and sane people will roundly ignore you.
Because there truly is not, and should not be, any right "not to be offended." Pull up your big girl panties and buck the heck up. The world is not made of sugar and spice, and every effort you undertake to make it so is a Very Bad Idea.
Push your controlling ideas too far, and someone will eventually push back. Odds are you really won't enjoy it.
Re: (Score:3)
Penis jokes are not hostile to women. Nor are posters. Anyone offended by a poster should not be taken seriously. It's not like women don't hang up calendars of men in their cubicles. No one cares about that..
Re: (Score:3)
But, but, but... Equality means women can do whatever we want and men can only do what we say. Now go make yourself a sandwich; make me one too, while you're at it. And don't forget to clean the kitchen afterward.
She sees the same absurdity in the "feminist" movement that I do. Note the quotes; I know a decent number of feminists who despise "feminists" as much as my wife and I do. They wear the label, loud and proud, but do nothing but damage the entire notion of gender equality, which hurts everyone.
Re:Animal House (Score:4, Interesting)
She sees the same absurdity in the "feminist" movement that I do.
The problem for feminists today is that their parents (or grandparents) won all of the easy battles. Now the only ones left are difficult and nuanced. Addressing them is hard - it's much easier to make up an easy target to attack than deal with real issues.
Re:Animal House (Score:5, Insightful)
There is no right to create a hostile working environment for women.
You are right. There's no reason to make boob-grabbing a sport at work, or install under-table cameras and post the up-skirt shots in the Intranet. There's no reason to announce publicly the menstruation periods of every girl in the office, or enforce a dresscode that ignores female anatomy. Definitely sex should not be a condition for promotion, and meetings should not start with blowjob requests, made in order of beauty to the attending women. Likewise, putting a single toilet for women into the basement while having men toilets everywhere.
Oh wait, you were talking about a software joke project on some random Internet site that nobody is forced to visit or even know about? Yeah, that definitely is the dictionary case for "hostile working environment".
the entire back office being papered over with pinups
That's absolutely the same as a random Internet site that nobody... why am I wasting my time here, a monkey would see the difference.
Re: (Score:3)
no matter how many lengths you go to
Careful, talking about length is hostile towards women, don'cha know?
Re: (Score:3)
No one is complaining that they should have the "right" not to be offended.
Wrong. LOTS of people do it. I see that kind of crap from one person or another on social media almost every day. And I have gotten it at work, too. Not for a long time, but it did happen.
Nobody -- or almost nobody, anyway -- wants a harassing workplace, but some people are just plain thin-skinned and get all offended at the drop of a hat. Those people don't have the right to make everybody around them miserable just because they won't grow up.
Jane is Lonny Eachus is a pathological liar (Score:3)
Oops, I meant to write that "Jane seems to be saying he isn't lecturing scientists about what scientists think."
Lecturing scientists about science is Jane's other hobby.
Re: (Score:3)
No one minds the calendar of hunks the women hang up. People who hang posters of things don't usually do it because they hate what's on the poster. Therefore, the argument about 'misogyny' is bullshit. We're so busy teaching everyone to 'check their privilege' all the time that people are starting to see 'misogyny' everywhere. If it was named 'CCUNTS' it would be laughed at by men, secure ones anyway. If women are equals then they should be equally secure not to take offense to 'DICCS' or some poster of
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While i agree that the world should not have to make itself safe for overly sensitive people, does anyone really think a project named "DICSS" is remotely professional? Do you really want to be associated with DICSS? I understand it's open source, not for pay, etc. but maybe it can have a socially acceptable name, and everyone can just call it DICSS.
I'd hate to go on an interview and someone asks me for a cde sample or something, and I tell them to go look at DICSS, that my contribution to DICSS is quite su
Re: (Score:3)
This is about a related 3rd party bringing down the hammer on a project because they feel they have the right to interfere because someone somewhere might get offended about a currently hot topic.
Re: (Score:3)
I understand, and those people are playing politics, and anyone with a brain realizes that they've set themselves up to lose badly. The question is whether going for the kill really benefits anyone. The best possible resolution is for the project leads to just change the name already, before further drama ensues.
The rational outcomes of this effort are this:
- Github would sensibly decide it is not going to be the censor police for project names, content, comments, submissions etc. This isn't misogyny, somet
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
Can I maybe suggest that either you don't contribute to this project then or if you choose to that you don't put it on your CV?
There, problem solved.
Some people don't care what other people's definition of "professional" is.
Re: (Score:3)
In fact the only purpose I can see to this name is to make bad jokes.
Or, it's an acronym for
Directly injected CSS
Don't forget Incontenentia Buttocks... (Score:5, Funny)
Not only is it funny (with overtones of pitiful), it gets a rise out just about everyone who cares to erect an objection. Rigid, upright individuals, blood flowing copiously to their heads, cocking their virtual pistols and ready to shoot the first time someone rubs them in a manner that provides enough friction. It's a penetrating form of humor, a kind of humor that some have to stretch to get, especially those who are anally retentive. For others, it's just plugging along as usual, strapping on the first thing they come to, and then using it to probe everyone within reach. I don't know why it's got you so inflamed. Me, I'm having a ball sacking the opposition. I can't do it all the time (I'm old) but I find it satisfactory to work in spurts. And while my youth is gone, at least I can remember it as not so much checkered, as spattered. Because the rubber didn't always meet the rode, y'see.
Re: (Score:3)
Basically what is happening here is that anything remotely male specific in the workplace is being banned .
This is why in my neighborhood, the PersonPerson delivers person every day, and drops it off in the person person.
Finally a truly gender equal solution to the sexually offensive "Mailman delivering the mail and dropping it off in the mailbox".
Millions of women turned bulimic over that injustice.
Re: Normal women... (Score:3)
Its not a workplace...its a guthub repo. Also you implied its not okay to have an unpopular opinion outside of the workplace...why wouldnt the "cant have an opinion brigade" jump on you?
What happens when you have a dissenting, unpopular opinion? In you're ideal world you wouldnt be able to express it. Wouldnt that bother you?
Re: (Score:3)
Racism is ok outside of the workplace? Thought not...
The workplace is a special situation where people's freedoms and rights are heavily restricted, and some conformist norms are imposed upon them, greatly limiting what actions and speech they are allowed, as people in a workplace are expected to behave in a "professional" prim-and-proper manner while they are present in a workplace, to promote productivity, successful business, and productive worker-coworker relationships within the environment.
The sa
Re: (Score:3)
Why is the workplace so special?
The workplace is special because people go there to earn a living, because without that paycheck they'll be homeless. Not that many people go to work just for the fun of it; most people go because they need money to survive, and would rather be sitting on the beach or hanging out with friends/family or just about anything else.
Because of this, society has decided that some rules are in order to keep being at work any more miserable than it already is, and to ensure people ha
Re:Normal women... (Score:4, Interesting)
Where are the "Female Anatomy" joke projects?
Or is reminding people that humans have sexual organs somehow denigrating women?
I mean, it is sexist by definition. Being based on sex and all that. But when can we, in a world of transgender and homosexual people, stop abusing sexism to mean 'only hurtful to women?'
Really, can we at least get a show of hands of the number of gay men offended by this low-brow dick joke project?
turn-about isn't just fair-play, it's PROPER play (Score:3)
That's the first thing that occurred to me. Look at all the games that focus on female anatomy. Now you get an entirely different group of people complaining. The game devs can't make even 1/2 the people happy at any given time. So why bother trying? Novelty sells. Cash in on it.
Re:turn-about isn't just fair-play, it's PROPER pl (Score:5, Insightful)
Or, maybe you could just be a little bit professional and don't use software projects to make jokes about anyone's anatomy.
I know, I know. If you were a little bit professional, you'd be getting paid for your work instead of contributing to some projects with other latent homosexuals who seem obsessed with penises. But still, a little bit of self-respect is a good thing, even if you don't happen to have any respect for anyone else. It looks good on your resume when you're not a complete asshole.
Re:turn-about isn't just fair-play, it's PROPER pl (Score:5, Insightful)
Or, maybe you could just be a little bit professional and don't use software projects to make jokes about anyone's anatomy.
Not all software projects are professional ones. There are projects "just for fun", as well. I think that's where this project lies.
Nobody should use it as-is for a professional project.
If you want to do that, then fork it first and clean out the inappropriate comments.
Re: (Score:3)
So basically,,, eeeeeeh ,, what you are saying is, don't be a dick.
Re:turn-about isn't just fair-play, it's PROPER pl (Score:4, Funny)
1) being a Catholic Priest
2) Being a Republican in Congress talking daily about "family values", and
3) constantly talking about penises, while denying thinking about penises.
Homosexuals I've run this list past tend to agree, and none have so far indicated feeling insulted.
Re: (Score:3)
PopeRatzo was making a reference to the Barney Frank Rule [laweekly.com]. It's okay that you didn't spot it (not everyone knows everything), but now you know.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Normal women... (Score:5, Insightful)
There is no right "not to be offended."
No such right should exist.
No one should agitate for such a right.
End of story.
Re:Normal women... (Score:4, Insightful)
I feel offended that some people want it to be illegal to offend.
Checkmate. :)
Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Insightful)
Since when is it the task of others to make one feel comfortable? Do alcohol jokes make recovering alcoholics uncomfortable? Do displays of wealth make the poor feel uncomfortable? Do candy aisles in supermarkets make dieters uncomfortable? Do dogs make victims of dog-attacks uncomfortable?
Why do women constantly get to claim they feel uncomfortable and expect the world to rush in and see to it that reality meets with their expectations?
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
The truly funny part is that women wanted absolutely nothing to do with computers until there was money to be made.
It was the domain of men not because of exclusivity but because it wasn't remotely sexy or interesting to women. Neckbeards and geeks tinkered with computers in the evening because they were 'into it'. And likely because they weren't going to get laid anytime soon anyway.
And then suddenly the field was the place to be. The money was flowing. The industry had sex-appeal. And just as suddenl
Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Informative)
How many women studied computer science in the early 90's?
I was at University from 1985 - 1990. Most of my undergrad CompSci TAs were women.
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
Definitely true at some schools. My experience was there were a few here and there. But it was heavily male. As are hard sciences, math and engineering departments. Social sciences and languages were heavily female.
Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Funny)
As are hard sciences,
There will be NO more of that offensive reference.
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Yeah, Grace Hopper [wikipedia.org] totally got into computing for the dolla dolla billz.
Oh wait, no she didn't. Your argument relies entirely on ignoring the fact that from birth until college, women are explicitly and forcefully discouraged from going into STEM fields. They're sexually harassed when they do make it over the hurdles and then called liars, cheats, and interlopers when they make it and ignore the bullshit.
This is an amazing comment because in your argument about how women are just in it for the money you act
Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Insightful)
That's a lovely cherry you picked. But your statement is really just outrageous. "Explicitly and forcefully discouraged"?? LOL. You're like a parody of feminist propaganda. Next you're going to tell us that the reason women have their own chess tournaments is that male chess grandmasters harass them.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
I have an account, but we live in a truly dangerous world at a truly dangerous time.
Showing identity while speaking the truth about "feminism" == I might make a female "uncomfortable". ... And that's one short hop to "harassment".
In Salem, young girls pointed at people and said they were in league with the devil. Those people (men and women) were burned alive. Today we live in a world where women are given the right to sentence a man without a jury and without evidence. It's really not much different. I
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Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:4, Insightful)
Look. Regarding that "forcefully discouraged" thing I keep hearing.
I have two kids, a girl and a boy.
The boy is younger.
Most toys he got earlier were his sister's.
And, mind you, I bought a lot of "boy" toys for my daughter (actually the first toys she got were "boy" toys, because "why on earth would we force "girly" stuff on hear" I said, but she got full range of em).
So lot's of cars and other machinery.
She played with cars now and then.
But my boy is simply obsessed with them. He has piles of toys to choose from, all kinds of them, but "Car" was one of the first words he learned.
I'm pretty sure out there somewhere someone is explaining that women are underrepresented in auto sports, cause, you know, "they are forcefully discouraged".
Here is, what I want to tell you: just STFU, ok? Cause MEN AND WOMEN ARE simply DIFFERENT!!. Nobody bans any sex from anything, but some disparity in some areas is more than natural.
Re: (Score:3)
And you kept both completely shielded from any forms of media so that there was no way that they ever would associate cars with boys? Of course men and women are different but how on earth would boys be genetically biased towards cars?
A kindergarten over here did a study some years ago where they videotaped how the staff interacted with the children. And to the staffs dismay they treated boys and girls completely different even though they believed themselves that they treated them equally. So the situation
Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Interesting)
And you kept both completely shielded from any forms of media so that there was no way that they ever would associate cars with boys?
The female vervet monkey in this picture prefers to play with dolls. The male vervet monkey prefers cars. [livescience.com] Do you think they were influenced by the media?
Re: Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Insightful)
Use to be that programming was woman work. But who cares about history when there is a rant to be made.
here's some statistics (Score:5, Interesting)
http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2014/10/21/357629765/when-women-stopped-coding
I'd encourage you to listen to the story as well.
Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Informative)
Why you stupid sonofabitch.
https://www.women.cs.cmu.edu/a... [cmu.edu]
Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Informative)
The truly funny part is that women wanted absolutely nothing to do with computers until there was money to be made.
That's sexist. Generalizing the motives of 50% of the world's population, 3 billion people. Worse still the generalization is a negative one. No, women couldn't be interested in computing, they are only in it for the money.
This is exactly what women are complaining about. It's no bullshit, you just demonstrated it.
How many women studied computer science in the early 90's? I'll tell you because I did: Basically none.
Either your memory is faulty or you were quite unlucky: http://nces.ed.gov/programs/di... [ed.gov]
Re:Define "Threatened" and "Unwelcome" (Score:5, Insightful)
Please, it isn't "women". It's a professional elite that gets "offended". People who consider themselves to be "leaders" and "moral guardians" and other such happy horse shit. People who are somehow "better" than all of us barbaric heathens. The dreamers and lotus eaters of society. It's their JOB to be offended. Some of those persons are female, to be sure, but there are a a couple billion normal women in this world who can find this crap slightly humorous, and/or just ignore it. A large number of women just groan over the stupidity, and move on with something important. Mostly, they don't really CARE about men's juvenile conduct, any more than WE CARE about their silly cosmetics, feminine hygiene, and shiny baubles.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Basically there's a war on men being men.
There is a war on men who are insecure dickless assholes at work when it comes to women --- and it's long overdue I've come to think. "Sell out their gender?" Give me a break.
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You live in a sheltered world then. White males more qualified can get passed over for job because a quota needs filled. Feminist literature is filled with hate against men, and superiority rather than equality the stated goal.
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Well, see, there are some people who don't feel they have to be dicks just because it isn't forbidden by criminal codes.
Some of those people even get laid once in a while.
There is such a thing as tact (Score:4, Insightful)
The trouble is, there are a _lot_ of folks who never learned tact, and blurt out whatever the hell enters their mind when ever it does; often just to get attention of any kind (good or bad).
So yeah, the world doesn't need to rush to meet their expectations, but a certain amount of civility at certain times/places is definitely called for.
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Since when is it the task of others to make one feel comfortable? Do alcohol jokes make recovering alcoholics uncomfortable? Do displays of wealth make the poor feel uncomfortable? Do candy aisles in supermarkets make dieters uncomfortable? Do dogs make victims of dog-attacks uncomfortable?
I answered them:
Do alcohol jokes make recovering alcoholics uncomfortable? Yes
Do displays of wealth make the poor feel uncomfortable? Yes
Do candy aisles in supermarkets make dieters uncomfortable? Candy aisles, cookie aisles, all those junk food aisles, absolutely positively yes! That's why people trying to diet try to avoid those aisles.
Do dogs make victims of dog-attacks uncomfortable? Very much so. I've seen them cross the street rather than walk past my dog.
Moral of the story? Don't ask questions if you're not ready to listen to the answers.
Are you forced to hide your dog to stop people being scared of it? No. Are you forced to keep the dog indoors? No. Are you told you should only go out when there's nobody nearby so that they don't see your dog and get scared? No.
Therefore your assertions, though correct, do not rise to the level of what's being demanded of here with the project.
Oh, and just what is being "demanded" of this "project"? Most people don't give a darn, because the project is bogus - just an attention-getting stunt done in bad taste. I don't think it rises even to the level of a tempest in a teapot. This non-story should never have seen the light of day. It's just clickbait.
My wife likes these kinds of jokes (Score:5, Funny)
She keeps wanting me to write a new operating system called PENIX.
It's not so much a brogrammer thing as a controversy between us low brow folks and snooty people who pretend that our dick jokes and fart jokes aren't hilarious.
Re: (Score:2)
There's the newish game called Besiege. There's a video on you tube of this giant robot someone built. It has fire coming out of its anatomy. It's fucking hilarious, but it's also pretty bad-ass.
I just don't get people that don't think it's awesome (my grandmother excluded).
Well for the people that can't deal with DICCS (Score:3)
They can try project CNDY 4$$
Is GitHub so concerned that they will ask him to r (Score:5, Insightful)
I feel like that it is borderline in this case, it is not a commercial product but an open source project, you may not agree but shouldn't they be able to run their own project how they want ?
Does this infringe some kind of law in the US ?
Why does github care? (Score:5, Insightful)
Should github be involved? We could ramp it up and pretend the project was actually hateful, instead of not being that at all. When should github care? If they are an open source repo, shouldn't they be that?
Here's an emulator for Nintendo hardware. It's safe on legal grounds (even though console companies have lawyered up and taken down some emus by threatening the authors):
https://github.com/dolphin-emu [github.com]
Here's an archive of "hacking tools". While almost everyone reading this post will understand the context of "hacking", and the fact that these are completely innocuous, would you put that past everyone in the world?
https://github.com/Gexos/Hacki... [github.com]
Remember, some people consider "hacking" to equal "a crime done to people that should be result in life in prison". Even among those that are a bit smarter than that, you could EASILY argue that labeling something a "hacking tool" is "encouraging people to commit a crime" or somesuch- there's a reason the crack pipes at the flea market are not labelled as such, and have a sign saying that if you call them that, they'll kick you out.
You could argue that the above two projects, along with MANY others, are offensive or encourage illegal activities. You may not agree, but the argument could be made.
If someone is concerned about some cock and balls jokes because some section of the population (certainly not "women" and not really even "feminists", but likely "people who professionally get offended about bullshit to honk their own horns"), I will point out that **there's already a ton of projects that would offend fucking SOMEONE**.
This shouldn't be a story at all.
Oh come on (Score:3)
It's one guy with a juvenile sense of humour. I don't get why people are making a big deal of this.
Re:Oh come on (Score:5, Informative)
Taking offense has become a powerful political tool.
Re: (Score:3)
People who are offended (Score:5, Insightful)
People who are offended by the project can just ignore it. Don't use it if/when it becomes a finished product, either. You're free to boycott, after all. You are even free to ask other people to boycott the project. You are NOT free to try to bully these juvenile delinquents into bahaving as you believe they should behave.
Hey, ladies and germs - you can't have it both ways. Just because you are offended doesn't justify cyber bullying, or any other kind of bullying.
In short, just grow the fuck up, alright?
On being offended (Score:5, Insightful)
http://theshake.com.au/wp-cont... [theshake.com.au]
People need to lighten the hell up.
Yes, we should make women welcome in FOSS. That doesn't mean we can't enjoy a good laugh at the same time. We all need to stop with this BS #activistmorality
Re: (Score:3)
Is there anything about this DICSS project that gave you "a good laugh"? How old are you that references to a penis is the height of comedy?
It made me laugh. Basically the bit that made me laugh was all the dick jokes, especially the good techy dick jokes. And the name because I like acronym abuse.
Are dick jokes hte hight of humour? Who cares. Like many other forms of humour, they are funny in their place. I also enjoyed the 21 jump streed film with is a 109 minute long dick joke, but a REALLY good one.
Uptight cultures (Score:5, Informative)
A little dirty humor "is controversial" in the United States and probably would be in, say, Iran. But there are cultures that consider talking about sex totally harmless. I know that's a foreign idea in a country where you can lose your job or, conceivably, end up in court or even prison for making a harmless joke at the wrong time or in front of the wrong person. Cultures that aren't so uptight are superior to ours.
Reminds of of something at a past job (Score:2)
For example, he would have code like this to represent the most significant and least significant words of a 32-byte unsigned int:
hungLo = wor
Re:Reminds of of something at a past job (Score:4, Insightful)
Remind me again what "wellHungLo" was supposed to represent?
I wouldn't consider someone who wrote code like that a "superstar". He sounds more like a cowboy coder who couldn't give a shit about code maintenance after he moved on to something else. I would have complained about his shitty naming and if management was too scared to fix such a massive fuckup then you're better off working elsewhere.
Should we have a vagina joke project too? (Score:2)
Maybe the DICSS project is juvenile and crude, but ignore it if you don't like it. None of Github's business.
A Broadway show would be OK (Score:5, Funny)
Should we have a vagina joke project too?
A software project, absolutely not. But a Broadway show would be OK.
Communist Mind Control Shite (Score:2, Insightful)
More power to DICSS ! Give the middle finger to the Femi-Nazi-Maoists !
extremists are extreme (Score:4, Interesting)
is it really news that a subset of people hate men and wish to eradicate gender? the more airtime these people get, the more they get to push their agenda and market themselves. so you hate the penis and have no sense of humour, great. stop complaining and go get some therapy.
This is one reason why IT doesn't get respect (Score:4, Insightful)
For the record, I'm a man who works in IT. I don't know enough about this project to take a stand one way or the other, but I do know that crap like this is why the IT profession (if you can call it that) struggles for respect. I see this sort of stuff all the time, and it's frustrating because I really thought we were beyond the stereotype of "asexual nerds living with Mom in the basement." Not everyone in IT has a juvenile sense of humor, but oh boy, those who do can sometimes make workplaces pretty uncomfortable. And no, I'm not easily offended, but it's not exactly the most professional interaction when you have to listen to someone talk about their adventures at the strip club in detail. Not the content so much, but usually it's because the people saying these things just make you think, "eww, gross." If I was a woman, I would sure select myself out of an environment like that.
For everyone who is going to respond to this in a "Fuck you, I can say and do whatever I want" fashion, can you please explain why it is so difficult to refrain from inappropriate jokes in an office environment? Does anyone in a work situation really need to hear about what you'd like to do with the hot new intern, etc.? I've worked both in "normal" office environments, and environments where behavior like this is tolerated or encouraged. Normal workplaces are a lot better in my opinion.
Same thing goes for overt sexual harassment -- I often wonder why we need to watch HR's presentation over and over again on this subject, then I see real issues in the news that I just can't believe. I wouldn't even think about saying/doing some of the stuff some guys are accused of, and it just amazes me that this goes in in 2015. I know there are a few people who develop a "rockstar" aura and can be untouchable in the eyes of management, but it would seem to me that unless you are the sole author of a company's core money making product, or an executive, you can't get away with this stuff anymore.
Re:This is one reason why IT doesn't get respect (Score:5, Insightful)
> can you please explain why it is so difficult to refrain from inappropriate jokes in an office environment?
A project on github, put together by people who are not being paid, is not an office environment.
Re: (Score:3)
That's an important point. I'm less likely to offended at jokes that are directed at oneself, or one's own sex. I'm also more likely to be offended by a questionable joke *if I don't know them that well*. That's why people should refrain from them in a professional environment and why they're asked to do so.
One of my best buddies has a Chinese background, and there are "you must know kung fu" jokes that I could say in his presence. He knows me well enough to know I'm making fun of the racism of it. I
Re:This is one reason why IT doesn't get respect (Score:5, Informative)
I see this sort of stuff all the time,
Been a C/C++ developer for 25yrs, in my experience this stuff is very rare in working code.
Normal workplaces are a lot better in my opinion.
I can only assume you have never worked in a male dominated blue collar job, such as a mechanics workshop, garbage depot, or a building site. I did that sort of work for 15yrs before moving to a white collar job. The first thing I noticed about working in an office was how polite most people are, the boss even says please and thank you. The second thing I noticed, the walls aren't covered with posters of semi naked women.
Thing is, TFA isn't about workplace behaviour, it's just some junk someone posted on the internet with the express purpose of becoming (in)famous for 15 minutes.
Re:This is one reason why IT doesn't get respect (Score:5, Insightful)
As someone who has worked in more than just the IT industry...
Your argument (TL;DR): IT is not respected because of "crap like this" and extrapolate to sexual harassment in the workplace.
1. It is humans across all industries that do this. IT is actually one of the better ones. Try working as a construction worker or in a law firm or hedge fund, or a flight attendant.
2. I used the word humans in point 1, because it is not just across industries, it is BOTH genders. Women objectify men all the time as well.
3. Your leap from harmless juvenile jokes to overt harassment is a lovely slippery slope fallacy. Juvenile humour (especially self mocking humour) and gender bias are quite independent of each other. Both women and men make dick jokes. If you don't know any then congratulations on having such a mature social circle, you must be proud.
Penis jokes are serious business! (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:3)
This is a hard topic which should be discussed at length!
Unfortunately society has gone soft on the issue and discussion has fallen short.
It's been a proper cock up.
Get a sense of humor! (Score:3)
Is anyone ACTUALLY offended? (Score:3)
Why are only women offended by potty talk? (Score:4, Insightful)
When it comes to unprofessional language in commercial, scientific, and engineering endeavours, there seems to be two assumptions people make:
1. All women are offended by the sorts of words and phrases used by 9th graders in their daily speech.
2. No men are offended by the same sort of language.
Both assumptions are incorrect.
Now, in most situations, I think that people should be able to say what they want. You can talk about body parts in naughty ways, and you can say all manner of insulting things (right or wrong) about anybody's religion. Basically, anything short of threatening to kill people. And if people get offended, they can shove it. I think that the proper and polite thing to do is to make sure that someone who doesn't want to hear what you say isn't forced to listen -- that to read what you wrote or hear what you said requires some positive action on their part, so if they don't like it, it's their fault for seeking it out.
However, in a professional setting, it's time to act like an adult. Discussions of sex and insults about religions are out of place, not because they're *fundamentally* inappropriate, but because they're accepted as inappropriate for professional and public settings. I'm sorry. I don't care how much you and your pals get a kick out of jokes about Jews and dead babies, people shouldn't have to listen to it at the office.
So, then there's this ambiguous situation with FOSS projects. Is this play time or work time? It's kinda both. People do it for fun, but if you don't want to make it a public thing, then you don't put it up on github. If your objective is to get public participation in a technically-oriented project, unprofessional language is out of place. If you want people to take FOSS in general serious, then unprofessional language is out of place. Linus Torvalds didn't publish the source code to Linux because he thought it would be hillarious or an asshole thing to do. The purpose was to attract people into a development community around the project.
In general, I object to certain subject being out in public where it's shoved up everyone's noses. Nude beach? No problem, because you have to travel there to see it. Nude parade down my street? That depends on the purpose, but there are many ways in which human nudity can be a good thing, for artistic, educational, or scientific purposes. (In general, I wouldn't be offended unless it was just really tasteless.) What about people in the nude parade having sex while they travel on floats down my street? No fucking way. I'm not a huge fan of Islam, and I think that its adherents deserve a great deal of criticism, constructive and otherwise. On the other hand, I would find it unacceptable to have to a parade whose purpose was to shout anti-Islamic hate language for everyone to hear. Speaking of screwing in the streets, that's one of the things that bothers me about gay pride parades. Standing up against oppression from bigots who hate you for a perfectly natural thing is good (homosexuality is ubiquitous in the animal kingdom). However, this does not require that your presentation be so hypersexualized that I can't take my kids to see it. (Honestly, we just dont need sex in the streets. Gay people are as normal and weird as any other subset of the population, living their lives, working jobs, etc. Connecting "gay" with "hypersexual" in a public event gives people the wrong idea.)
The bottom line is that people need to learn to be considerate and have some professional decorum. If you're going to do or say something that might insult someone, do it in a principled way as a means to be constructive. Do it because you DO give a shit, not because you don't. This applies to FOSS projects as much as to any other situation.
Although I wouldn't necessarily say you have the "right" to be an asshole, it's vital that you have that freedom. Consider obscenity laws that restrict porn to certain venues. Those may or may not have some value, but laws that try to cu
Re: (Score:2)
I really don't think that ANYONE "has to use it". As you state, it is open source. Anyone can get forked on open source - or with open source - or - well - you know what I mean, right?
Re: (Score:2)
Women could write their own program. I'm in need of a Bidirectional Open Optical Bus Interchange Engine System.
Re:I am going to see who committed on that project (Score:4, Insightful)
Honesty.... who looks up random projects on the internet they don't like and then tries to build a 'shit' list of employees they have prejudged to advise not to hire? It sounds like agenda-driven hiring, or attempts to conform hires to your personal view of the world, rather than good judgement on what is best for the employer.
The joke project is not egregious. If the applicant has the good judgement to not bring it up, and not conduct such things in the workplace or professional settings, then it should be ignored, And I would not want to hire or promote any staff member to reviewing resumes who would be so petty.
It is not a crime, but it does indicate an attitude which makes me believe that a person who revels in such behavior will make a poor team player.
This appears to be a fundamental attribution error on your part. Their commits do not demonstrate for sure any basic attitude; you thus attributed apparent action to attitudes which do not necessarily exist. The only thing we really know here is they participated in a personal capacity in a non-professional setting on a project containing some sort of joke that someone else deemed as violating some current or past social taboo, And, possibly they might have made the mistake of failing to use a separate private or semi-private pseudonym while doing so.
I would infer that that persons 'sense of humor' and attitudes would make it difficult for them to integrate into a team of mixed genders, religious beliefs, and moral attitudes.
This appears to be a rush to judgement for your part, but there actually is not enough information to appropriately judge. One example of an instance of someone's personal sense of humor does not say how they will (or would not) integrate into a team.
I sure wouldn't want to hire you as a referee for resumes, or as a judge in general. The guilty verdict would come down, before the defendant even got to made their case repudiating all the apparent "evidence" from the prosecution.