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Education Programming

K-12 CS Framework Draft: Kids Taught To 'Protect Original Ideas' In Early Grades 132

theodp writes: Remember that Code.org and ACM-bankrolled K-12 Computer Science Education Framework that Microsoft, Google, Apple, and others were working on? Well, a draft of the framework was made available for review on Feb. 3rd, coincidentally just 3 business days after U.S. President Barack Obama and Microsoft President Brad Smith teamed up to announce the $4+ billion Computer Science for All initiative for the nation's K-12 students. "Computationally literate citizens have the responsibility to learn about, recognize, and address the personal, ethical, social, economic, and cultural contexts in which they operate," explains the section on Fostering an Inclusive Computing Culture, one of seven listed 'Core K-12 CS Practices'. "Participating in an inclusive computing culture encompasses the following: building and collaborating with diverse computational teams, involving diverse users in the design process, considering the implication of design choices on the widest set of end users, accounting for the safety and security of diverse end users, and fostering inclusive identities of computer scientists." Hey, do as they say, not as they do! Also included in the 10-page draft (pdf) is a section on Law and Ethics, which begins: "In early grades, students differentiate between responsible and irresponsible computing behaviors. Students learn that responsible behaviors can help individuals while irresponsible behaviors can hurt individuals. They examine legal and ethical considerations for obtaining and sharing information and apply those behaviors to protect original ideas."
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K-12 CS Framework Draft: Kids Taught To 'Protect Original Ideas' In Early Grades

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  • Good news! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by mwvdlee ( 775178 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @09:54AM (#51445509) Homepage

    Kids will learn to protect original ideas.
    So they'll learn not to protect unoriginal ideas like 99.9% of software patents.

    • apply those [responsible and irresponsible] behaviors to protect original ideas.

      That sounds a lot like kids will learn to protect the original ideas of others, in other words to respect the stakes driven into the ground by the incumbent corporations in prior intellectual land-grabs. Sure, if you come acros an original idea yourself, you might be able to stake your own claim, but most of these "ideas" are already locked up tight.

      • It is not about protecting "their" ideas, it's about brain washing people that it's okay to own an idea. This already happens today, but we sure don't hear any debate about the Government fixing patent trolls and the laws that allow abuse. In reality, that is small potatoes. Big players own all the big ideas. No need to troll is involved.

        The brain washing will stop us peons from challenging the status quo.

        • by mwvdlee ( 775178 )

          It's brain washing.

          By deliberately using an overreaching definition of what can be legally, ethically and morally protected.

          Specific implementation of ideas are protectable by patents.
          Specific performances of ideas are protectable by copyright.
          Ideas themselves cannot be protected.

    • I'm sure the government school's ethics class will be as philosophically rigorous as the folklore they teach as history is factually accurate.

      And that it'll err o

    • by Anonymous Coward

      The kids won't be learning to protect their own ideas. They'll be learning that all of their ideas were already thought of by some big company, so they shouldn't try to fight the inevitable patent lawsuit and just settle out of court.

  • Brainwashing 101 (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 05, 2016 @10:00AM (#51445559)

    get them while they are young.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      For me this sort of thing backfired. Growing up I was repeatedly told about America the free, America the brave, etc.

      Now as an adult, I actually value freedom and bravery, and am disgusted by virtually everything this country does. A brave country doesn't piss itself over statistically insignificant acts of terrorism (whether Islamic or homegrown gun violence), a free country doesn't spy on its own innocent citizens or systematically disenfranchise the poor.

  • by Roger Wilcox ( 776904 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @10:09AM (#51445623)

    Sounds like a pretty good argument for taking the federal government out of education entirely.

    Centralized mind control through propaganda; acculturation of our nation's youth to silence, oppression, and acquiescence to authority; normalization of the police state; blind nationalism through a fantastic daily "pledge." All of these things are strong counterarguments to the "fair and equal opportunity/better education for all " kind of rhetoric that comes out of Washington.

    Seriously, think of the children. Think of all the misguided ideas their heads will be filled with. Think of the cultural values they will be taught to cherish and those they will be taught to revile. Think of the world they will grow up to accept or even create.

    Whatever happened to civics class?

    Teach your children well... and keep them far, far away from federally funded schools.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      I wish this wasn't modded up. It's taking a shallow cut on a finger and arguing we should throw out the whole human.

      Federal standards for education are a good thing and should be STRENGTHENED because:
      1. We can ensure everyone has access to a quality education. Some states really give poor/minority students a shit deal, and in the south have a history of doing this on purpose.
      2. We can ensure science is SCIENCE, not a Christian religion class.
      3. We could bring back a REAL civics class and ensure it is available to
      • Let's decide what great education looks like, and fight to make sure EVERY child in this country has access. Let's not settle for letting a regressive state like Kansas hurt their kids with a bad education AND GET AWAY WITH IT.

        Interesting that sentiment starts with "Let's" and then immediately paints another view as regressive and bad, then shouts a call to arms. Reminds me of the guy in the movies waving the torch and urging on the mob.

        • Right, because trying to keep church and state separate and advocating for quality education is the same as inciting a mob. Or maybe you don't have a substantive argument to counter mine.
    • "Sounds like a pretty good argument for taking the federal government out of education entirely."

      Do you think the states would be any better? Or local?

      Or even private schools - that just results in the parents sending their child to a school dedicated to raising miniature clones of themselves.

      Children will be indoctrinated. That is their nature. You cannot teach them without forcing ideas upon them, because they instinctively mimic the society to which they are exposed.

  • by OzPeter ( 195038 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @10:16AM (#51445677)

    The full quotes from TFA, Law and Ethics section

    K-8 Progression
    In early grades, students differentiate between responsible and irresponsible computing behaviors. Students learn that responsible behaviors can help individuals while irresponsible behaviors can hurt individuals. They examine legal and ethical considerations for obtaining and sharing information and apply those behaviors to protect original ideas. As students progress academically, they engage in legal and ethical behaviors to guard against intrusive applications and promote a safe and secure computing experience.

    9-12 Statement
    Laws impact many areas of computing in an effort to protect privacy, data, property, information, and identity. The legal oversight of computing involves tradeoffs; such laws can expedite or delay advancements and infringe upon or protect human rights. Ethical concerns also shape computing practices and professions. International variations in legal and ethical considerations should be examined.

    So based on 3 words in a DRAFT statement of a section that considers Laws and Ethics, you want tar and feather the whole course? Where the fuck do you consider legal aspects of computing if you don't do it here. And FFS this could easily apply to GPL or any other such license that relies on the legal framework to enforce its restrictions.

    • by jedidiah ( 1196 )

      The GPL is about implementations. So is any other license as that is the domain of copyright. The concept of "original ideas" is fundementally flawed and doesn't even match up with any existing form of "intellectual property". It is inappropriate in scope from a purely legal point of view. It's a pro-corporate distortion of the current legal framework.

      From an academic viewpoint (as in University academia), then entire notion of "original ideas" in computer science is laughable. Computer science is full of r

    • So based on 3 words in a DRAFT statement of a section that considers Laws and Ethics, you want tar and feather the whole course?

      Wakey, wakey, there was already more than enough justification to tar and feather the businesses pushing this latest boondoggle. Way more than enough. They should be charged with conspiracy to defraud.

  • the only way to protect and "original idea" is to not share it with anyone. this seems like an idea that microsoft should be protecting/not sharing instead of spreading like a cancer.

  • From Microsoft's latest 10-Q SEC filing [shareholder.com]: "Even as we transition to a mobile-first and cloud-first strategy, the license-based proprietary software model generates most of our software revenue. We bear the costs of converting original ideas into software products through investments in research and development, offsetting these costs with the revenue received from licensing our products."

    • We bear the costs of converting original ideas

      Let me FTFY: "We bear the cost of stealing (Stacker, etc), buying out (Powerpoint, etc), and locking out (Java, IE, Word formats, etc) via incompatibility other's original ideas to pursue our god-given right to do whatever the hell we want to."

      • The typical big company model is indeed to acquire new/original ideas from smaller companies - and these often do not come cheaply. So, next time you're hit up with $100 fee for a copy of your operating system, feel good about the hundreds of "little guys" who landed multi-million dollar buyout deals from the big fish, and try not to think about the billions being hoarded in offshore tax havens.

  • what a relief! (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ooloorie ( 4394035 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @10:41AM (#51445861)

    Core K-12 CS Practices'. "Participating in an inclusive computing culture encompasses the following: building and collaborating with diverse computational teams, involving diverse users in the design process, considering the implication of design choices on the widest set of end users, accounting for the safety and security of diverse end users, and fostering inclusive identities of computer scientists.

    I was worried for a moment that generations of elementary school children would be forced to suffer through actual computer science content, like programming, sorting, assembly language, and computer architecture. I'm relieved that my worries were unfounded: they just seem to be forced to suffer through the same social activist crap they already have to sit through, except instead of the penguin getting along with the lion, it will now be expressed in the more kid-friendly terms of "inclusive design" and "team diversity". Yay!

    • ...they also won't have to worry about learning what the hell Open Source is, how it benefits humankind (and indeed the big corps too), how they can contribute and be useful, and how it has it's own legal framework that's remarkably easy to stay comfortably inside if you have half a brain. They'll be far too busy trying to learn about imaginary property, non-transferable licenses, annual subscriptions and contract lengths.

      All sounds great to me ;-)

  • by WOOFYGOOFY ( 1334993 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @10:42AM (#51445877)

    Here's the full quote:

    "In early grades, students differentiate between responsible and irresponsible computing
    behaviors. Students learn that responsible behaviors can help individuals while
    irresponsible behaviors can hurt individuals. They examine legal and ethical
    considerations for obtaining and sharing information and apply those behaviors to protect
    original ideas. As students progress academically, they engage in legal and ethical
    behaviors to guard against intrusive applications and promote a safe and secure
    computing experience. "

    What these Kings of the Universe don't realize is normal people don't share and will never share their Ayn Rand -cocaine-driven amphetamine-fueled vision of extreme indivuduality at the expense of the health of society (which is the bedrock upon which protection of individuality rests).

    So, sure, go ahead promote those discussions. The more discussion there is, the less well it goes for software patent lawyers like Brad Smith who, readers should know, basically originated the idea of using software patents as an offense weapon to supress innovation while he was at M$:

    http://arstechnica.com/busines... [arstechnica.com]

    http://archive.fortune.com/mag... [fortune.com]

    which directly led to all other tech companies following suit and finally the fantastical, supernatrual prosperity of every Chinese take-out in Tyler, Texas.

    All that's going to happen is they're going to find out no one shares their idea of societal good and justice. Every survey finds that young people are far more concerned with creating an fair, free and egalitarian society that benefits everyone, rather than the winner-take-all psychopathic shithole that is America at this particular tick of the clock.

      Not everyone blew their brains out snorting coke while reading Ayn Rand in the 80s. That's a particular generation and they have a particular , uh, "view" of what the goals laws of society should support. Going on 40 years later now, it's getting to be old-man-dying-time for this particular strain of sociopathic, societal predators. Can't happen too soon for my money. Here, take it with you; fuckin' see ya later.

    • Sadly, this Randian generation you speak of may be the first to significantly extend the lifespans of their most rich and powerful - for all our sakes' lets hope Kurzweil's time frame is as fantastical as it seems to be.

  • Can anyone tell me what "fostering inclusive identities of computer scientists" actually means?

    • Re:Huh? (Score:4, Funny)

      by msauve ( 701917 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @10:50AM (#51445937)
      ITIM there should be no reserved characters when naming computer scientists. Not sure if the names are case sensitive though. I suspect sensitivity training would tell us they are.
    • Can anyone tell me what "fostering inclusive identities of computer scientists" actually means?

      What you're supposed to think it means: "Make it so misogyny, racism, and homophobia that pervades computing (and only computing) doesn't make women and minorities feel unwelcome in tech jobs."

      What it really means: "White, heterosexual men are bad and keeping others from competing. The only reason there are fewer women and minorities in computing is because the evil White-Patriarchy makes off-color jokes occasionally, not because of any personal choices, lower socio-economic status, or education."

    • Can anyone tell me what "fostering inclusive identities of computer scientists" actually means?

      1. Induced Multiple Personality Disorder.
      2. Cross-gender hormones. LOTS of them.
      3. Mandatory physical mutilation so they can understand what the "differently enabled" go through.
      4. Obligatory classes on becoming part of the Borg.
      5. Removal of the funny bone so that they can't tell jokes that might offend someone.
      6. Learning the proper newspeak, where "diversity" always really means politically correct conformity.

    • The quality of the design, code, etc. is less important than some meaningless or circumstantial characteristic of person who wrote it.
  • "Referrer Madness" become required viewing in the schools?
  • by Simulant ( 528590 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @11:02AM (#51445999) Journal
    You keep paying my salary for 70 years after I'm dead and I'll consider paying for your fucking IP.
    • by tepples ( 727027 )

      You keep paying my salary for 70 years after I'm dead and I'll consider paying for your fucking IP.

      There are life insurance companies that offer this service.

  • Yes Miss Berthnal, I did my homework.

    No, I didn't hand it in. It is being reviewed by my attorney. You'll likely get it in 6-12 months, although it may be a bit longer. There were some excellent concepts there that he says need protection.

  • Then, Mommy (or your best friend, or your Dad, or whoever) is going to show you how to download all the torrents of your favourite show!

    And guess what?

    - If Mommy does it, it can't be all bad.
    - If you can get High-Def versions, it's actually real cool.
    - If, during recess, you can swap all those episodes of your show for other shows that are also real cool, you make other people happy.
    - And, later, you realize you can relive a bit of your childhood for cheap, since you don't have to buy the DRM Digital versio

  • They examine legal and ethical considerations for obtaining and sharing information and apply those behaviors to protect original ideas

    There is is ... the indoctrination aspect of this to ensure the kids are all fully compliant digital citizens. This shit is exactly what happens when you let corporations drive the curriculum.

    This is just more bullshit control being exerted on our lives by asshole corporations.

    I weep for humanity, because the next generation is being raised to be good little fucking corpora

  • "Participating in an inclusive computing culture encompasses the following: building and collaborating with diverse computational teams, involving diverse users in the design process, considering the implication of design choices on the widest set of end users, accounting for the safety and security of diverse end users, and fostering inclusive identities of computer scientists."

    As a very introverted child, this sort of curriculum would have turned me right off from programming. I was attracted to compute

  • which involved the biggest, most-privacy-robbing corporations getting in bed with a massive central government went a little fascist....who'd a thunk it?!?!?

    Stupid ignorant morons who refuse to study history and willfully ignore nearly everything America's founders wrote are likely to be surprised. The rest of us: not so much. Part of the basic idea of human civilization is that each generation ought to learn the lessons of their predecessors; it saves lots of time and pain to dodge the pain of errors by r

  • by TsuruchiBrian ( 2731979 ) on Friday February 05, 2016 @02:46PM (#51448197)

    The best way to protect ideas is to copy them as much as possible. Protecting the "owner" of an idea is a different story. This involves restricting use of an idea only to people that have paid for the rights to the idea.

    Do we need intellectual property laws? Probably, but what current intellectual property laws do is more like protecting young girls by ensuring they can only marry who pays their father the most money.

  • And, of course, IDEAS can not be patented nor copyrighted, only the implementation
    So why teach kids not to use that which is lawful use?
    because Mickey is an IDEA (says Disney)

Statistics are no substitute for judgement. -- Henry Clay

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