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Businesses Technology

Amazon Employees Launch Matchmaking Startup For Coworkers (geekwire.com) 170

reifman writes: As posted earlier, Amazon's growth and predominantly male hiring has made dating in Seattle incredibly difficult for everyone. Two Amazon employees, Becca Goldman and Mahvish Gazipura, recently launched DateADev to help coworkers optimize their dating profiles: 'at Amazon [we're] surrounded by software developers and project managers all the time, we just noticed their need. We talk to them all the time about their frustrations with dating.' Goldman's gone on more than 500 dates in the past three years. 'Her experience ... helps her quickly assess an online profile of a potential partner.' Rather than drive its employees into moonlighting, Amazon could just start hiring more women.
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Amazon Employees Launch Matchmaking Startup For Coworkers

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 20, 2016 @06:55PM (#51739579)

    Maybe the problem is You ?

    Says the forever Virgin -_-

    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by penguinoid ( 724646 )

      I'd say she's probably conducting a scientific study on lonely males. 500 data points so far. I admire her dedication. You go, girl.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      500 dates?

      Maybe the problem is You ?

      Problem?! What problem?

    • by mwvdlee ( 775178 )

      Goldman's gone on more than 500 dates in the past three years

      Her experience ... helps her quickly assess an online profile of a potential partner

      Apparently it doesn't.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:02PM (#51739601)

    ..... or allow its employees to have lives outside of the company. Either/or.

    • This assertion that corporations should allow their employees to have lives outside of their companies is completely antithetical to American values and should be banned as hate speech. I hope you get locked up and waterboarded in Guantanamo for saying such a thing. Absolutely disgusting.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    500 dates??!! WTF?!! Be less picking and maybe try talking to them on the phone for a few minutes before you even bother to meet for coffee or a drink. I know a couple of my younger coworkers go on lots of dates for the free dinner but they are kind of tacky like that.

    Personally, I stick to the under $10s rule for the first date. Unless you just live in the most boringest place in the world, there are usually enough free places to go that work perfectly for a first date. Spending money is not required and i

    • by Frosty Piss ( 770223 ) * on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:07PM (#51739635)

      Personally, I stick to the under $10s rule for the first date...

      I'll bet you don't have too many "second" dates...

  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:07PM (#51739639)

    If women *did* like dating engineers (in America), this problem would resolve itself.

    Of course, there are reasons why women don't like dating engineers:

    1) Social myths and stigmas about engineers.
    2) The realities behind the social myths and stigmas about engineers.
    3) Engineers tend to be introverts and beta-males, and as such they don't exude the sense of power that makes men attractive to women (despite their wealth).

    These are social problems. They need to be fixed by social means. Another online dating service won't accomplish that.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Frosty Piss ( 770223 ) *

      Not all Amazonians are engineers.

      Engineers tend to be introverts and beta-males, and as such they don't exude the sense of power that makes men attractive to women (despite their wealth).

      I keep hearing this. It's an anecdote that doesn't hold true in my circles.

      • I keep hearing this. It's an anecdote that doesn't hold true in my circles.

        Sssh. You'll upset RedPill theory [reddit.com]. Let them convince themselves that there aren't any women out there and they don't want engineers.

        • You do know that telling people about this place is going to drive more traffic to it. It's one of the few places anywhere where men don't get shamed for wanting to have sex.

          • You do know that telling people about this place is going to drive more traffic to it.

            At this point the signals completely lost in the noise anyway.

            It's one of the few places anywhere where men don't get shamed for wanting to have sex.

            Odd. I've never had that problem. Nor any of the other problems that TRPers whine about. Then again I don't act like women are vending machines dispensing sex after enough nice guy tokens are entered or any of the other random problems they have. Hell my female friends never shamed me for wanting sex. (But That means I also had female friends, a concept beyond most TRPers).

            • | I don't act like women are vending machines dispensing sex after enough nice guy tokens are entered

              Only beta males act like that.

            • TRP cured my bad back. True story. I walk taller since spending time there and my 20 year back problem has disappeared. I don't go there much anymore because the right wingers have taken the place over and there's only so many times you can read "cultural Marxism" before you think "oh piss off".

              You've clearly not spent any real time there if you think TRP is full of nice guy types. The underlying attitude is to treat women badly not to orbit them in the hope of some attention.

              Using that tedious feminist phr

          • by dbIII ( 701233 )

            You do know that telling people about this place is going to drive more traffic to it. It's one of the few places anywhere where men don't get shamed for wanting to have sex.

            Few places? Most of the internet seems to be outright porn, even the ads on relatively mainstreams sites.

      • by dbIII ( 701233 )

        Not all Amazonians are engineers.

        There are all those high school graduates who think they deserve the title due to being able to cut and paste other people's PHP.
        That bunch and those with an actual degree, but not in engineering, leads to a pile of social myths and stigmas about engineers. For one thing there are a greater percentage of women among engineering graduates than in CS and related degrees so engineers are better socialised than IT types in general.
        As for the second point directly above, also tr

    • Meh, good engineers are confident at the very least ... However software engineers are the only exception to that. The funny bit then is that the closest related field (electronics) generally already is a huge difference. Was really noticeable in college: the IT engineering students were playing games on their laptop in the cafeteria while we were hanging out with the (mostly female) chemistry majors. And then about the *hire more women* stereotype. Confidence is a major asset for technical staff anywher
    • These are all correct, and this is why engineers should look for women from Asia to date, rather than dating American-born (and especially Caucasian) women. Women from Asia have a totally different outlook on engineers, and see them as good, stable partners with very good income potential. Asian women also tend not to care too much about "alpha males" or men who try to emulate Hollywood stereotypes and want men who are loyal and good providers for their families.

      So the answer is simple: Amazon should just

  • Bad Idea (Score:5, Insightful)

    by alvinrod ( 889928 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:08PM (#51739641)
    If you're hiring women solely so that the male workers have someone to date, it's just asking for trouble. Anyone who's ever seen a workplace relationship turn bad knows what I'm talking about. Also, from what I've heard about Amazon, it's not the best place to work in terms of work-life balance. I don't think Amazon is actively avoiding women so much as the only people stupid enough to sign up for something like that are young 20-something men who don't have a family yet or the experience to realize what they're signing up for.
    • If you're hiring women solely so that the male workers have someone to date, it's just asking for trouble

      It solves a few problems and I think you are adding meaning that was not actually there.

      In short, monocultures suck. Having someone from outside your home town avoids the embarrassment of local slang on your website confusing the fuck out of visitors and excluding half the human race from consideration narrows perspective and can lead to fuckups. Look at how out of touch some people in politics are on

  • by Anonymous Coward

    it simply won't work. I've lived in Seattle for eleven years, and I've only met one single female that's within -10 and +5 years of my own age. In the current company I work for, there's about 320 men and 80 women, and no unmarried women. I don't know where they're hiding.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      This. After living in South Lake Union in Seattle not far from Amazon for two years and going out three or more nights a week, I haven't met a single unattached female. There just aren't any around here.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      If you think Seattle is bad, you should try Bellevue. It's about ten miles from Seattle and on the other side of Lake Washington. It's a great city with amazing tech jobs, found a new job three different times in less than a week, but I don't think I've ever seen a girl in a bar or club that wasn't already with a guy.

    • by penguinoid ( 724646 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:22PM (#51739721) Homepage Journal

      Sorry to burst your bubble, but a lot of those women you met are single. They just told you otherwise.

  • This will create a similar situation that we have with education.
    A child grows up going to school.
    Goes to college.
    Become a teacher.
    Who teaches students
    who goes to college
    and becomes a teacher.
    This creates part of the problem with education where there are still a lot of Victorian values and methods going on, because there is little outside influence in their experience.

    Now with Amazon what this will do is match Employees, who work with Amazon values, who will date and possible have children. And portrait su

  • by SuperKendall ( 25149 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:13PM (#51739673)

    Amazon "Could Just" hire more women.

    Ok, from where?

    The bad thing about hiring quotas by any determinate like race or gender or any pool with a smaller population, is that ALLOF THE COMPANIES are trying to generally do the same thing.

    So lets say Amazon does succeed in doubling the hiring rate of women - doesn't that mean there are a LOT of companies now short their "share" of women? In fact is it any wonder that small companies are so devoid of women when so many large companies are trying so desperately to hire women? Centralizing technical women in a small number of companies in fact seems like a terribly bad idea to me and is probably exacerbating all of the technical culture issues people have noticed (which must be said are rooted in Silicon Valley and not nearly so bad outside that echo chamber).

    The whole thing makes me sick honestly, and to me seems to objectify women vastly more than, say, porn...

    • by Anonymous Coward

      just write down "female" on your job application. it's highly shitlord-like behavior to question a gender based on appearance (beard, penis, etc).

    • The bad thing about hiring quotas by any determinate like race or gender or any pool with a smaller population, is that ALLOF THE COMPANIES are trying to generally do the same thing.

      Half of human species is women, you know.

      • So you are saying Amazon can hire any random women into a technical position (because that is what we are talking about, technical positions)? Has it really come to that?

        • by dbIII ( 701233 )
          That's pretty well how the outsourcing goes - fill a technical position with a random person in India or somewhere and then the client of the outsourcing company has to train them on the job.
          Maybe we should try that at home and actually start training people again. Hire people (men and women) to do a technical job and train them to do it instead of hoping that a resume is not a lie.
          • If by "random person" you mean some kid who has spent a few years learning to program in some Indian tech course, then yes. They don't just train them from scratch, they start from a base of SOME understanding.

            • by dbIII ( 701233 )
              Some understanding? Sadly that is being optimistic.
              Also there are plenty of people with more than K-12 that just need a few weeks to get up to speed on some of the things where HR filter based on years of experience and somebody else doing the training.
    • by dbIII ( 701233 )
      A sign that half the human race doesn't want to work in an industry is a bit of a sign that things are fucked up. I've seen more women working in mines than IT lately.
      Quotas are an act of force feeding the situation and assuming that the only problems are in hiring, so a quick attempted fix that makes people annoyed instead of doing something about the feedback loop that has been driving women out of IT for years.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:18PM (#51739697)

    If a woman buys a book on IoT or Spark, and she's young (based on her music purchases) and has weight proportional to height (based on clothing buys), you've got her email address, so send her a nice followup note.

    • ... weight proportional to height ...

      Strictly speaking, everybody has a weight that is proportional to their height, it is just a matter of numbers.

  • by TiggertheMad ( 556308 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:26PM (#51739741) Homepage Journal
    As a male dev who has interviewed and knows people at Amazon, the problem isn't lack of an app. After I went out to talk with them for a day, I came away with the impression that there are a large number of really arrogant and pushy people working there. Undoubtedly, my personal experience isn't statistical representation of the whole company, but I wasn't very impressed with them as people. They seemed stressed, hurried, egotistical, and self-centered. I didn't want to work there for money, so I could imagine that few women would want to date people like that for free.

    Anecdote: If you go on a date and the date goes poorly, the person may have been a jerk. If you go on 10 dates and they all go poorly, chances are you are actually the jerk. If nobody at Amazon can land a date, what does that tell you? A lack of girls in Seattle? For being so smart, you seem pretty slow...
    • If you go on a date and the date goes poorly, the person may have been a jerk. If you go on 10 dates and they all go poorly, chances are you are actually the jerk.

      And if you go on 500 dates and they go poorly (more or less), the problem is you beyond any reasonable doubt. I mean there's just no more room for doubt at that point, none.

    • It sounds counterintuitive to shy programmer males, but pushy, arrogant men are in great demand by women. It's sad but unfortunately true.

      "I could imagine that few women would want to date people like that for free. "

      You are so, so wrong, my friend. You're looking at it from your own perspective, not from a woman's perspective. I hope you can get the wisdom you seek to improve your chances with women, because you have wrongheaded ideas about what women are looking for in a man. :(

      • I hope you can get the wisdom you seek to improve your chances with women, because you have wrongheaded ideas about what women are looking for in a man. :(

        I have been with the same girl for over 20 years. We are quite happily married, I really don't need to improve my chances with women. Also, women don't want pushy arrogant men, many seem to like men who are confident, bold, and decisive, but nobody with a healthy psychology gravitates towards people who are belittling and abusive. I think you might b
        • So you've been out of the market for 20 years and have no idea what's going on. Thanks for letting me know you don't need any help and I should help others instead. Nowhere did anyone say 'abusive' until you brought it up. Please stop giving advice on what young women want from men, you have no idea what you're talking about.
          • "So you've been out of the market for 20 years and have no idea what's going on."

            Women don't work or evolution the way your iPhone does. No: women 20 years ago, or 200 years ago, or 2000 years ago for that matter are not any different than today's. Neither are men. Yes, some external looks do change, just like you can put a new cover to your old mobile, but the motherboard and the WiFi chip stays the same.

            • However, society changes, and so does the situation a woman finds herself in, and therefore what the woman looks for in a partner. It's also more socially acceptable for women to date a lot of men than it used to be, so the woman could be looking for a fun date (whatever that is for her) or something longer-term. (Disclaimer: don't look to me for dating advice. I got just successful enough to find one good one, which is all I need.)

          • Please stop giving advice on what young women want from men, you have no idea what you're talking about.

            ...Or based on evidence of a long, successful relationship, I know exactly what I am talking about. I think you are the one here who needs help, you have some, um, 'interesting' ideas about how women think.

            And, 'pushy and arrogant' == abusive. Perhaps not in the 'slap a woman around' sense of the word, but someone who values themselves above others and subtly belittles others is abusive. There is a
      • Nope.

        You're confusing things. Women, well actually everyone, likes confident people. Confidence overall is attractive. It'd easy to confuse confident and socially skilled with pushy and arrogant especially if that person has just got something you wanted.

        By the way, I think the red pill contains as mix of PvP, acid and laxatives.

    • After I went out to talk with them for a day, I came away with the impression that there are a large number of really arrogant and pushy people working there. Undoubtedly, my personal experience isn't statistical representation of the whole company, but I wasn't very impressed with them as people. They seemed stressed, hurried, egotistical, and self-centered.

      I have to call BS on this. What you're describing is typical American culture. American women, being part of that same culture, should be happy to da

  • What the hell? (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward

    They're not only not forbidding coworkers to date one another, but actually encouraging it? How is this not a sexual harassment disaster waiting to happen? Or is it all hunky dory because a woman came up with the idea?

  • The trifecta (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Kwyj1b0 ( 2757125 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:29PM (#51739751)

    An article about more women in Tech, Amazon, and Dating geeks.

    The clickbait is strong with this one ;)

    That being said, two questions jump to mind. One, I heard that Amazon employees sign contracts that every idea they might have, even if unrelated to their primary job, is the property of Amazon (it is Seattle, so I think the contract is enforceable). Does that hold true here? And secondly, just hire more women?? I never heard of Jeff Reifman, but he sounds like a class act, NOT. His chief tip? "Offer larger signing bonuses for women". Is that even legal?

    I have Karma to burn, so I'll ask a question that has been on my mind for a while - is gender balance (in any industry) a goal? Or is it a means to a goal. I often hear "We need more women in Tech", but I don't understand why that is a goal by itself. It might be more clear to say "we need smart people in Tech, and smart women are turned away from STEM, so we need to fix this". Because there might be other ways of achieving the second goal (irrespective of gender), while the only way to achieve the first is to make the hire ratio even.

    • by tomhath ( 637240 )

      I have Karma to burn, so I'll ask a question that has been on my mind for a while - is gender balance (in any industry) a goal? Or is it a means to a goal.

      That's a very reasonable question, but the answer is "neither". The goal is equal opportunity; quotas don't solve that problem. A doctor would point out that they are treating one symptom while the patient is dying of the disease.

    • > smart women are turned away from STEM

      Bullocks. There are plenty of smart women in STEM. It's a personality thing, the more egg headier the workplace, the less likely people are going to take half thought-through ideas or concepts or "emotions." Plenty of smart men and women don't run in STEM circles because they're too quick to conclusions or decisions and don't think about the implications. There are also different kinds of "smart" - a mechanic with 30 years of experience probably knows some thin
  • I suppose it's something that an employer is sympathetic to what we might call lifestyle deficiencies of its employees, but what are they planning to add to the equation? Matchmaking is thousands of years old.

    Maybe they think they can do it "on a computer" and get a patent, but I'm pretty sure there's some prior art.

  • by marcle ( 1575627 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:31PM (#51739765)

    500 dates in 3 years is about 3-4 dates a week. Are each of them with different guys? Sounds exhausting.

    • Is she rejecting all the guys asking her out on second dates? Or are guys not asking her out on second dates?

      'Her experience ... helps her quickly assess an online profile of a potential partner.'

      I dunno. Do you really want to trust the judgment of someone who hasn't yet found a partner after 500 dates?

    • Sounds exhausting.

      This is what I was thinking... This is one high energy person.

      Good for her though. I think she has a much higher probability than most to find exactly the right person.

  • by PuddleBoy ( 544111 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @07:32PM (#51739773)

    Let's see; 500 dates in, say, 1200 days comes out to another date every 2.4 days.
    Assuming that a date often consists of dinner and maybe a movie, we'll say it occupies about 4 hours per date.
    If the average person sleeps 7 hours per day, during those 1200 days, she was awake 20,400 hours.
    Of those waking hours, we'll estimate that she worked approx 8500 hours, leaving 11,900 hours for everything not sleep or work related.
    Take away at least 2 hours per day for various daily, unavoidable activities like showers, breakfast, dressing, cleaning... So that's another 2400 hours.
    That makes 9500 hours that might fit into the category of discretionary time.
    The dates occupied 2000 hours, or roughly 21% of all her discretionary time.
    I'd call that throwing yourself into your work...

    • by Anonymous Coward

      Don't forget the money angle. Assume middle class or better partners. 30 bucks spent on her per date equates to 5k a year on entertainment she didn't have to spend. If she went upper class with her preferences she could be making 15k a year extra.

    • by hawguy ( 1600213 )

      Let's see; 500 dates in, say, 1200 days comes out to another date every 2.4 days.
      Assuming that a date often consists of dinner and maybe a movie, we'll say it occupies about 4 hours per date.

      If she's doing a 4 hour dinner+movie date for every first date, no wonder she's frustrated - when online dating, a first date should be something quick and easy to end early if it's not going well -- like drinks or coffee, so when it's clear that the date is not working out, you can bail early before investing too much time.

      That said, she should be spending most of her time in screening profiles and sending a few emails to figure out basic compatibility, even a couple phone calls. Once she's done that, the

  • Given their reputation, I suspect the problem is getting women to accept offers of employment. At least the women I know were far too intelligent to want to be trapped into that lifestyle.

    Or are you suggesting that Amazon should change itself so that there's some semblance of work-life balance, because I don't see that happening anytime soon.

  • of course! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 20, 2016 @08:49PM (#51740189)

    Amazon could just start hiring more women.

    Sure, hire more women to make the male devs happy! In fact, to make them really happy, why not hire women as cocktail waitresses, masseuses, and exotic dancers, right?

    The sexism of social justice warriors really knows no bounds.

  • Why won't they check their fucking cis privilege? All they do is ruin the hugbox that is supposed to be the workplace.

  • "Goldman's gone on more than 500 dates in the past three years. 'Her experience ... helps her quickly assess an online profile of a potential partner.'"

    Lol, apparently her experience does NOT help "her quickly assess ... a potential partner".

    No offense, Ms Date-a-holic, but if you've gone on 500 dates and haven't found a partner...the problem is YOU, beyond any reasonable doubt.

    After 50 or 100 dates you better start looking in the mirror at just who you are, and that goes for guys as well as gals. Either yo

  • The question is, how many cows signed up?

  • by PPH ( 736903 ) on Sunday March 20, 2016 @11:14PM (#51740873)

    ... their results for "Customers Who Bought This Item Also Bought", I'm wouldn't place too much faith in their selections. Unless it has a good return policy.

  • by BlueCoder ( 223005 ) on Monday March 21, 2016 @05:03AM (#51741725)

    As far as doing work which is engineering... you need the socially awkward culture. And like it or not for the most part that isn't women. That's a different kind of intelligence. Being polite and politically correct is not what you need in engineering. You need straightforwardness. You need to be sure of what you say and not be afraid to say it. You can't be afraid to be wrong.

    What could be possible is social, speaking and communications training. And while the men would also benefit from social training I think women women would benefit more by adapting to and understanding the social conventions of men. Learn to be politically incorrect. Love ideas and what you do; not people. Be problem focused. Male nerds don't necessarily like each other; it's more we only tolerate each other. We are rude to each other and we are all headstrong.

    • I very strongly disagree with you. It's perfectly possible to be firm, honest and technically strong without resorting to rudeness, "political incorrect" stuff or hiding rudeness being the pretense of politeness. Compare for example:

      "Why the Fuck did you make that design? Are you a Fucking retarded fag? "

      Versus:

      "Your design is unworkable because self sealing stem bolts won't hold up under those conditions."

      The second one is not rude, not politically incorrect and more useful than the first. Rudeness is oft

  • 500 'dates' in 3 years?
    What's a date then?
    Going out for drink or a meal?
    Going out for drink or meal with someone of the opposite sex (or gender spectrum)?
    The above but with potential romantic considerations?
    And does two dates with the same person count? After all, 500 dates with the same three people doesn't say much about your ability to find dates.

  • .. what more could any dev need?
  • Maybe someone should start slashdate.org

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