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Programming United States Technology

Billionaire-Backed Code.org Received $1-2 Million Federal PPP Loan 50

Posted by msmash from the how-about-that dept.
theodp writes: Code.org's $10+ million "Diamond" supporters include Microsoft, Facebook, Amazon, and Infosys. Its $3+ million "Platinum" supporters include Google, the Gates Foundation, and the Ballmer Group. And its $1+ million "Gold" supporters include Jeff Bezos and Bill Gates, the world's two richest men. So, it was somewhat surprising to see the nonprofit -- which is dedicated to pushing CS into K-12 classrooms -- pop up on the list of Seattle-area tech companies that received a PPP loan from the federal government. According to Paycheck Protection Program data released by the SBA and Treasury, Code.org was approved on April 15th for a loan between $1-2 million to retain 81 jobs due to the pandemic. Khan Academy, another pet nonprofit of Gates and other billionaires, received approval for a $2-5 million PPP loan to retain 185 jobs.
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Billionaire-Backed Code.org Received $1-2 Million Federal PPP Loan More

Billionaire-Backed Code.org Received $1-2 Million Federal PPP Loan

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  • This is false equivalence and a distraction. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by psperl ( 1704658 ) on Tuesday July 07, 2020 @02:12PM (#60271940) Homepage
    These organizations are wonderful and do great things and this "controversy" is false equivalence. These organizations receive donations from billionaires. So what? There's no conflict of interest here, the billionaires don't own or benefit from these organizations receiving PPP funds, unlike Kushner and McConnell. The cynical side of me suspects this is an attempt by the right to distract from their heinous misuse of PPP funds to Trump and McConnell family businesses and churches.

    • This really just draws attention to the fact that they did not receive enough donations from these billionaires during the pandemic. Would have been the tiniest drop in the bucket to get that extra support - but apparently they didn't.

      • Both Code.org and Khan Academy have cash reserves and would not have folded without the PPP. But that isn't the point. The PPP is not designed to keep companies from failing but to give businesses a cash cushion so they can keep all their employees.

        Nobody knows how long the lockdown will last, so without the cushion companies would be proactively trimming payrolls.

        It is a LOAN. Not a gift. So they will pay it back, with interest. So who cares?

        My spouse runs her own business and received a $150k PPP loa

        • Some of them may not be repaid, but a few dud loans are better than a depression.

          They are about 80% forgivable, depending on how you spend it. The vast majority will fall into that eligibility.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Luthair ( 847766 )
      Here's a question though - are these businesses, e.g. are these loans offsetting some income they might otherwise have earned in a non-covid situation? If its not offsetting earned income to me this seems a bit questionable, though its not on Gates & al.

      • PPP loans aren't about revenue - they're about expenses (payroll). Lack of revenue may cause the crisis, but in the non-profit case that may be lack of donation (or for museums / concert halls, the lack of admissions/events).

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Luthair ( 847766 )

          PPP loans aren't about revenue - they're about expenses (payroll). Lack of revenue may cause the crisis, but in the non-profit case that may be lack of donation (or for museums / concert halls, the lack of admissions/events).

          Your example for museums & concert halls is literally about offsetting revenue. The point is if these organizations are operating off of an endowment, does it really make sense that they also get the PPP?

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Cederic ( 9623 )

          PPP loans aren't about revenue - they're about expenses (payroll).

          Surely they're to offset the loss of revenue, so that costs can still be met.

    • Re:This is false equivalence and a distraction. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Nidi62 ( 1525137 ) on Tuesday July 07, 2020 @02:28PM (#60272018)

      These organizations are wonderful and do great things and this "controversy" is false equivalence. These organizations receive donations from billionaires. So what? There's no conflict of interest here, the billionaires don't own or benefit from these organizations receiving PPP funds, unlike Kushner and McConnell.

      The cynical side of me suspects this is an attempt by the right to distract from their heinous misuse of PPP funds to Trump and McConnell family businesses and churches.

      I think the issue is the idea that groups like Code.org, Kushner, the LA Lakers, Ruth's Chris, and that hotel chain down in Texas all have access to sources of capital that most businesses don't, either through patronage with Code.org or through sheer size like most national chains. The Lakers could easily get a loan from a bank because they're the Lakers. Franchisees should be able to go to their parent company for support (delayed franchise payments for example). And of course those large chains have bargaining power with banks as well. But the small mom and pop stores that might only employ 5-10 people, those are the ones who really needed the money, and they were the ones least likely to get it.

      • Re:This is false equivalence and a distraction. (Score:4, Interesting)

        by BrainJunkie ( 6219718 ) on Tuesday July 07, 2020 @02:51PM (#60272146)
        If that is the issue, how does it get resolved?

        For the companies you name this seems like just another business decision. Would the PPP terms be better than any of the routes you specify, whether from a strictly financial standpoint or in terms of effort versus reward? If yes, why take the more difficult route?

        If it is true that large companies could have gotten the money elsewhere yet made the business decision to use PPP I don't think it is them we should take issue with, it is our legislators because they made it easier to get PPP even when other options existed.

        The idea that corporations should take some sort of moral stand absolutely prevades Slashdot discussions, and people here are almost universally disappointed in the outcomes. I tend to think this outcome is inherent, not just under US style capitalism but pretty much anywhere humans are involved. If there is some sort of government directed sweet deal on offer, some amount of it will be fleeced always.

        • Re:This is false equivalence and a distraction. (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Art Challenor ( 2621733 ) on Tuesday July 07, 2020 @03:12PM (#60272258)
          There was a requirement for the loan, albeit a fairly ill-define/loose requirement, that you were economically damaged by the COVID-19 epidemic. I feel it's unlikely that online education sites were injured at all, more likely the opposite. Hotels, restaurants, (even the LA Lakers) etc. are on much more solid ground and while I agree that some should not have been able to benefit from the program, it was set up so that they could.

      • Indeed. I'm all for helping "the little guy" but when DeNiro-backed Nobu is taking out $11-28 million to support the $300/plate sushi restaurants for well heeled 1%-ers, that certainly caught my attention. There's a littany of companies that clearly could leverage other arenas for capital but they're instead crowding out small businesses and muscling in on the assistance money.

      • I think the issue is the idea that groups like Code.org, Kushner, the LA Lakers, Ruth's Chris, and that hotel chain down in Texas all have access to sources of capital that most businesses don't,

        I don't think that's fair though. The PPP is the Paycheck Protection Program.

        Sure a company like Ruth's Chris could keep all of their employees on staff with access to capital from elsewhere but will they? Hell no. The two outcomes were:
        1) Ruth's Chris lays off all of its employees.
        2) Ruth's Chris takes free money to keep its employees on payroll doing nothing.

        #1 dumps all of their employees onto state Tax payer's backs and bankrupting the state. All of those employees then have to file for unemployment, o

      • Their access to source funding is not relevant, this is not meant to supplement their income, it is an incentive or mechanism for them to keep staff on when the economic and business justifications would say they should otherwise lay off staff. Just because you have money doesn't mean you will or should keep on staff that are no longer productive, especially if you are a not for profit organisation.
    • They should not have gotten PPP. The PPP was for SMALL businesses. Businesses that actually create jobs.

      Code.org does not fall into that category.

      • They should not have gotten PPP. The PPP was for SMALL businesses. Businesses that actually create jobs.

        Code.org does not fall into that category.

        Could you be specific what you base that on? This is what their full team looks, like https://code.org/about/team [code.org] seems like a small business to me (except they are a non-profit), and I assume they are getting paid.

        • They should not have gotten PPP. The PPP was for SMALL businesses. Businesses that actually create jobs.

          Code.org does not fall into that category.

          Could you be specific what you base that on? This is what their full team looks, like https://code.org/about/team [code.org] seems like a small business to me (except they are a non-profit), and I assume they are getting paid.

          They should not have gotten PPP. The PPP was for SMALL businesses. Businesses that actually create jobs.

          Code.org does not fall into that category.

          Could you be specific what you base that on? This is what their full team looks, like https://code.org/about/team [code.org] seems like a small business to me (except they are a non-profit), and I assume they are getting paid.

          Could you be specfic on how Code,org falls under the guidelines of the PPP? [sba.gov]

          From what I see, they all FAIL.

          • Could you be specfic on how Code,org falls under the guidelines of the PPP? [sba.gov]

            From what I see, they all FAIL.

            I know this is slashdot and we have our conventions but from TFA: "The loans are forgivable for qualifying small businesses with 500 employees or less that retain their workforce or use the money to rehire laid-off employees. Businesses can apply for up to 250% of their monthly payroll." If you believe that the money was given in error you should report this to the proper authorities.

    • the billionaires don't own or benefit from these organizations receiving PPP funds

      Of course they do. They own companies that directly profit from a greater supply of coders.

      You think there's some other reason that they back "code.org", rather than, say, "healthcarecareers.org"?

      Privatize profits, socialize costs. It's the new quasi-ethical way.

  • I was reading yesterday that an audit of who has been receiving these loans has included quite a few companies that are flush with cash already and quite a few that ultimately are owned by members of Congress. Take from that what you will.
    Oh, and props to companies that returned the money because they didn't really need it. Shows character. We need more of that around here.

    • Oh, and props to companies that returned the money because they didn't really need it. Shows character. We need more of that around here.

      No props. They were caught and called out.

      • I can neither confirm or deny that at this moment in time, but I'm willing to take your word on it. Will go look later.
  • I am qualified to teach most languages and I would happily open a whole training center for that much money. I live in a low income area, and I'm sure many people could benefit from it. Too bad don't have the lobbyists to get it.

    • I am qualified to teach most languages and I would happily open a whole training center for that much money. I live in a low income area, and I'm sure many people could benefit from it. Too bad don't have the lobbyists to get it.

      They are running a nation wide training center while afaik you're not, so on the face of it, it only seems fair that they should get the loan whether they have lobbyists or not or am I missing something?

      • They are spending money teaching school kids. There are no more school kids with the affinity for programming than for professional sports. They should be teaching people who want to learn later in life. It could be done far more effectively.

        • They are spending money teaching school kids. There are no more school kids with the affinity for programming than for professional sports. They should be teaching people who want to learn later in life. It could be done far more effectively.

          Then I sincerely hope that you start and get funding for such an organization and if it's any comfort I don't think the money discussed will influence your chances of accomplishing this.

          • I'm pretty good at all things tech but I am not a marketing expert. Nor do I have money to pay for one.

            • I'm pretty good at all things tech but I am not a marketing expert. Nor do I have money to pay for one.

              I'm not US so specific advice is hard, but I'd look for a target group. Who for instance would pay for (or benefit in such a way that they'd be willing to pay) for the retraining of persons who have lost their jobs where the jobs are not realistically coming back (coal mining and some jobs lost to covid comes to mind)? Another option would to go into teaching, that would give you time and additional experience to develop the coursework and then partner with local authorities or a private company to bring it

              • It is part of my overall plan. If my side business ramps up I will train people to work for it. Right now just a dream.

    • What languages? If you're talented and hard working, go for it. But frankly it sounds like you're making excuses for yourself.

    • I am qualified to teach most languages and I would happily open a whole training center for that much money.

      If you're qualified to teach most languages, then I'm sure you could teach them at coffee shops, public libraries, community centers, or in people's homes/apartments (including your own or at your friends). Where there is a will, there is a way. You wouldn't need a whole training center.

      And if you did have a whole training center, then applying for PPP funds so you could pay your staff would actually make sense. After all, such staff would need to eat.

      But if you don't have a staff and if you didn't actually

  • Right wing actively trying to put this on Democrats when they own the executive branch. If this happened during Obama they would have put it on him and you know it. Trump is somehow immune from cronyism and corruption charges solely because his anti-immigration stance and tacit support of racists causes is too important to 95% of Republicans.

  • The problem we have, in terms of democracy and taxpayers, is that there is no transparency in the distribution. This means that individuals are investigating and posting what they see as unfair as clickbait, with little context. For instance, we know that conservative organizations that are purely political in nature, are received huge amounts of money. We also know that religious organizations, that in the past have been based on principles of discrimination and racism, are also receiving great deal of mo

  • Link to Data for Your Own Analysis (Score:5, Informative)

    by eepok ( 545733 ) on Tuesday July 07, 2020 @02:45PM (#60272122) Homepage

    Paycheck Protection Program Data: https://sba.box.com/s/tvb0v5i5... [box.com]

    Here's the link to the CSV so you can run your own analysis. It's over 600k rows, so be warned that if you try to run pivots in Excel, you'll need a bit of RAM.

    By the way, you can have some fun by looking up BS company names and following the addresses back to BS locations. 5 minutes in and I found a dozen companies whose existence I question.

    • or give it a quick search here https://pppreport.org/ [pppreport.org]

    • And remember the current Administration didn't think we shouldn't see the information! Jaw... Dropping... Corruption.

      Trump genius is this: Lie all the time and no particular lie stands out. Be a raging hypocrite continuously and no particular hypocrisy stands out. Be in-your-face corrupt all the time and no particular corruption stands out.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by trawg ( 308495 )

      This data doesn't seem to include company names in the CSVs, is there a separate set that has that? I just get a 100MB zip file with it broken down by state, and the only fields are:

      LoanAmount City State Zip NAICSCode BusinessType RaceEthnicity Gender Veteran NonProfit JobsRetained DateApproved Lender CD

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by trawg ( 308495 )

        replying to myself - company names are only available for companies that took more than $150k of loans, otherwise you just get the fields I pasted above. Source [treasury.gov] on the Dept of Treasury site.

  • Learn to steal.

  • Board Roles and Responsibilities [councilofnonprofits.org]: Board members are the fiduciaries who steer the organization towards a sustainable future by adopting sound, ethical, and legal governance and financial management policies, as well as by making sure the nonprofit has adequate resources to advance its mission.

    Code.org Board [code.org]: Brad Smith President, Chief Legal Officer, Microsoft...

    Khan Academy Board [khanacademy.org]: Larry Cohen CEO, Gates Ventures...

  • Were they eligible? Did they break the law by applying for them? Yes to one, no to the other, then what difference does it make?

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