Single Mom Sues Coding Boot Camp Over Job Placement Rates 128
An anonymous reader quotes a report from Yahoo Finance: A single mom who signed up for a $30,000 income-share agreement at a for-profit coding bootcamp has filed a lawsuit in California, alleging she entered the agreement under "false pretenses." Redmond, Washington-based Emily Bruner is suing Bloom Institute of Technology, formerly known as Lambda School, and its head Austen Allred, alleging they misrepresented job placement rates, operated without a license during her course of study, and hid the "true nature" of the school's financial interest in students' success. "I feel like Lambda misled me at every turn -- about their job placement rates and about how they would prepare us for jobs in the field. I was even more shocked when I found out they were operating illegally," Bruner said in a press release. "I took time away from my young son and other career opportunities to participate in a program based on lies," added Bruner, who's seeking a refund from the school as well as monetary damages. "While I'm thankful I opted out of arbitration so I can have my day in court, I wish my classmates who were also misled could be here with me."
Income-share agreements, known as ISAs, are an alternative type of student loan financing where a borrower receives a loan, then pays a percentage of their income after graduation. The terms of an ISA depends on various factors, such as their major topic of study and projected future earnings. [...] Bruner, the plaintiff, signed her ISA on June 29, 2019 when she was living in New Mexico because she could not pay the full tuition amount to attend Lambda full-time, according to the lawsuit. She says she moved back home to North Carolina to live with her parents, who would help her take care of her baby. She took out $30,000 for its six- and 12-month computer science programs offered by San Francisco-based Lambda, according to the complaint. Bruner started school in September 2019 and finished the following August. Students at Lambda agree to pay 17% of their post-Lambda salary for 24 months once they make more than $50,000 a year, according to the lawsuit.
After graduating, she couldn't find a job as a web developer or a software engineer, and was, according to the lawsuit, told by employers that "she did not have the technical skills for the job, and that her education had not prepared her to be a web developer." Bruner ended up going back to program management, a field she was working in prior to attending Lambda. In the lawsuit, she alleged that Lambda misrepresented the fact that it did not have necessary approval from the state regulator, the California Bureau for Postsecondary Education. She also alleged that the school falsified and misrepresented the school's job placement rates. Finally she also alleged that the school hid the true nature of its financial interest in students' success -- specifically by "falsely representing" that Lambda only was compensated when students found jobs and earned income.
Income-share agreements, known as ISAs, are an alternative type of student loan financing where a borrower receives a loan, then pays a percentage of their income after graduation. The terms of an ISA depends on various factors, such as their major topic of study and projected future earnings. [...] Bruner, the plaintiff, signed her ISA on June 29, 2019 when she was living in New Mexico because she could not pay the full tuition amount to attend Lambda full-time, according to the lawsuit. She says she moved back home to North Carolina to live with her parents, who would help her take care of her baby. She took out $30,000 for its six- and 12-month computer science programs offered by San Francisco-based Lambda, according to the complaint. Bruner started school in September 2019 and finished the following August. Students at Lambda agree to pay 17% of their post-Lambda salary for 24 months once they make more than $50,000 a year, according to the lawsuit.
After graduating, she couldn't find a job as a web developer or a software engineer, and was, according to the lawsuit, told by employers that "she did not have the technical skills for the job, and that her education had not prepared her to be a web developer." Bruner ended up going back to program management, a field she was working in prior to attending Lambda. In the lawsuit, she alleged that Lambda misrepresented the fact that it did not have necessary approval from the state regulator, the California Bureau for Postsecondary Education. She also alleged that the school falsified and misrepresented the school's job placement rates. Finally she also alleged that the school hid the true nature of its financial interest in students' success -- specifically by "falsely representing" that Lambda only was compensated when students found jobs and earned income.
nothing (Score:5, Funny)
prepares you to be a web developer.
Re:nothing (Score:5, Funny)
My heart goes out to everyone who must face the horror known as "Angular."
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prepares you to be a web developer.
That's right. And if a person is trying to become a proficient one in 6 months or even a year, well - there's your problem!
Despite the modern narrative, there is nothing like experience. Years of experience. You don't get experience in a classroom other than how to be in a classroom.
The story behind this though is kind of obfuscated, being framed in a student debt crisis, women in STEM, and single mom outlook.
So trying to flesh out the relevant details, we're left with questions. Is this a breach of co
Re: nothing (Score:2)
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Bingo. There are Ivy League graduates who can't get job placement... the degree is just a starting point. You need to develop skills beyond what is taught in any classroom. It's too bad she got suckered by grifters, but it also sounds like she simply doesn't have what it takes to be a Dev.
I'll probably get modded to Slashdot hell for this, but we have attempted to make Developer or programming a career path for everyone.
It surely isn't. I have worked with quite a few ladies who are fine engineers and programmers. One who was a web developer - so I can't judge very well on that.
But the thought process required is not the same as the thought process that many women have who choose to go into different fields.
The ladies I've worked with that thrive think like a developer. They think like
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Of all the women I've met in IT they're either so good they don't need your help or so bad that they want you to do their job for them. Nothing in between.
The women who are good at IT are great to work with. The ones that aren't are like any other person who can't hack and think that once they've finished the course they don't have anything else to learn.
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Of all the women I've met in IT they're either so good they don't need your help or so bad that they want you to do their job for them. Nothing in between.
We had two in my department who were examples of that. Let's call them Melissa and Judy. Melissa was a joy to work with. Very competent, good sense of humor, A nice person, she was that good right out of college. She asked for a reference a couple years back. I told the company she was trying to get employ at that they would be making a huge mistake if they didn't hire her.
Then there was Judy. Judy was pleasant enough, but had some real work issues.
In my department, I would pick up slack if people be
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Judy kept giving me things to do. Wow, she must have been busy. Then I found that she was sending me all of her work, then hopping on Facebook
There must be some kind of manual for this is exactly what my colleague was experiencing (I was his mentor). He would tell me this exact scenario. One day, after she had offloaded a pile of work onto him I decided to be a little cheeky and have a look at what she was doing by having a peek over the wall, sure enough, facebook.
I decided to offer her an opportunity to improve her career and test her claimed "shell scripting" skills by assigning her a task that would help the team. She declined with "I j
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Judy kept giving me things to do. Wow, she must have been busy. Then I found that she was sending me all of her work, then hopping on Facebook
There must be some kind of manual for this is exactly what my colleague was experiencing (I was his mentor). He would tell me this exact scenario. One day, after she had offloaded a pile of work onto him I decided to be a little cheeky and have a look at what she was doing by having a peek over the wall, sure enough, facebook.
I decided to offer her an opportunity to improve her career and test her claimed "shell scripting" skills by assigning her a task that would help the team. She declined with "I just wants to do my job". From that point on no-one in the team would help her as she was a burden no one wanted to carry.
And the toxicity starts! There is a really big problem with quota hiring. People who should probably not be in the job, get the job. It's a sad fact.
She went on to start with subtle verbal abuse of some of the other members of the team. A rabid feminist, she put both of my (well respected and supportive) managers in a potentially embarrassing situation, to which the team quietly assembled a case against her if she decided to pull the pin and go after someone.
Another sad fact is that we've reached a point where not d
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Aggressive POS, that one. I've always wondered what HR offices do with this sort of thing. In a world where the woman is generally assumed to be the victim, when you have a sexual harassment issue between two women, I envision an HR equivalent of divide by zero.
I'd never talk to HR about this kind of thing. I've experienced mobbing before by "men", as soon as someone starts on me, I start recording on the assumption that it will escalate. Which it has and both times I already had my lawyer set up and informed. If I have to take action, I'll try to leave for a new job before I have to. Too often HR sides with the bully, rather than the bullied because it is easier for them to make the victim submit.
However women are more subtle and more sneaky so I've impro
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Too often HR sides with the bully, rather than the bullied because it is easier for them to make the victim submit.
Holy smokes - that struck a chord. The whole way back to Junior High school when I had some bully issues. That's exactly what happened until I fought back. Nothing was ever said to the guys giving me crap, but trying to take care of it through channels, I was threatened with suspension or worse. Then one nice spring day at lunch they let us go outside after eating lunch, the bully tried something and he got the crap beat out of him. Irony was the shop teacher who was in charge just told me "Good Job Ol - bu
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College teaches you how to learn, and introduced concepts that may not come to you to allow you to dig in and research further.
I learned how to code when I was a kid,. While in highschool I got a job writing software (FoxPro). I was able to take the requirements and make a program that worked.
However after college, a lot of the "magic" went away, taking dull classes in Data structures, and Formal Languages. I was able to get back into the market at the next level.
School isn't job training, but it does help
Re:nothing (Score:5, Insightful)
I disagree, Kids at school pick up a raspberry pi (back when you could buy one !) and talk to their friends, crack a book and get a simple web page running - the "hello world example" is a pretty low bar. From there you can hoist yourself up to entry level web developer over six months just by trying things out, reading books from a good library, joining forums etc. so long as you put the time in. What could you learn given good reference material if you dedicated 3 hours a day to it for 6 months ? Something substantial I imagine
Of course anyone coming from outside the field couldn't know that, and some are taken for a ride. But it's a field where the cost of failure is low if you practice on your own time (hardly like dentistry say) and a prospective jobseeker could easily go from zero to an example portfolio to show a prospective employer in 6 months with no formal training and about the same amount of time input as attending a course
For sure there will be some employers who want to see a degree, but there are others who will hire based on seeing a good example of prior work
So to anyone attempting to get a foot in the field I suggest buy a laptop, buy a book, join some tech forums and start developing a relationship with someone offering entry level programming jobs
once you get a position you have a salary you can use to get credentials
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I think the main difference between your posts is whether students can or should rely solely on their school experience after graduation or whether they're willing to spend extra time on their own. In a lot of IT that willingness is an implicit job requirement in part because of rapid technical evolution and the proliferation of specializations.
Re:nothing (Score:5, Informative)
whether they're willing to spend extra time on their own.
I'm lucky I became a developer before I became a single parent, because "willing to spend extra time" and "able to spend extra time" - especially the kind of extra time needed to actually get decent at software development - can be two very different things.
In particular, it's helpful to have long stretches of uninterrupted time to focus on programming problems, and one thing that kids are very good at is interrupting you. Learning/doing software development and taking care of children are not compatible activities.
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That's true, but it makes a good basis to ask revealing questions - what problems did you encounter, how did you overcome them, what part of the code do you feel is especially elegant or novel, what tools did you find useful, how did you cope with browser compatibility challenges, how did you test it etc.
You start at the bottom, and work your way up. That's anathema these days, I know. But it actually works.
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I disagree, Kids at school pick up a raspberry pi (back when you could buy one !) and talk to their friends, crack a book and get a simple web page running - the "hello world example" is a pretty low bar. From there you can hoist yourself up to entry level web developer over six months just by trying things out, reading books from a good library, joining forums etc. so long as you put the time in.
But that many youthful years of activity is experience. That's how I picked up most of my early experience. But the big thing is that I was really interested. Thing number one.
What could you learn given good reference material if you dedicated 3 hours a day to it for 6 months ? Something substantial I imagine
If you are really interested, yes. I've taken some crash courses in a very short time period, but that take interest and motivation. Web development is probably one place where you need to be pretty motivated. I do Dreamweaver, and while it's second nature now, there was a learning curve that my interest had to sustain.
Of course anyone coming from outside the field couldn't know that, and some are taken for a ride. But it's a field where the cost of failure is low if you practice on your own time (hardly like dentistry say) and a prospective jobseeker could easily go from zero to an example portfolio to show a prospective employer in 6 months with no formal training and about the same amount of time input as attending a course
For sure there will be some employers who want to see a degree, but there are others who will hire based on seeing a good example of prior work
So to anyone attempting to get a foot in the field I suggest buy a laptop, buy a book, join some tech forums and start developing a relationship with someone offering entry level programming jobs
once you get a position you have a salary you can use to get credentials
If highly mot
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You are quite right about experience vs. classroom. The fraud is that the school claimed that you could actually become proficient and hireable just by completing the course. A specific claim that is clearly false (clear to someone who is proficient, that is).
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You are quite right about experience vs. classroom. The fraud is that the school claimed that you could actually become proficient and hireable just by completing the course. A specific claim that is clearly false (clear to someone who is proficient, that is).
Especially in that timeframe. If she is motivated, an entry level position might be the ticket. Although now, she is going to have a reputation as someone who uses the legal system. It looks like it might be justified, but a prospective employee who bypasses litigation will get a prospective employers attention.
Odd thing is if the place doesn't have any license, a simple phone call would have allowed her to wreak havoc on them. Hard to give money to a place that doesn't exist any more.
Re:nothing (Score:4, Insightful)
Imagine being a web developer and coming to a 24 year old website that doesn't support unicode input on forum posts. But HTML entities worked fine ... “£©®”
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German Umlauts, typed on Windows, also work fine. But not from a Mac (because the Mac uses unicode).
Re: nothing (Score:3)
Re: nothing (Score:5, Informative)
That's pretty much what traditional "coders" do, transform written information into data codes and enter them into software. For example,
What is Medical Coding? [aapc.com]
Medical coding is the transformation of healthcare diagnosis, procedures, medical services, and equipment into universal medical alphanumeric codes. The diagnoses and procedure codes are taken from medical record documentation, such as transcription of physician's notes, laboratory and radiologic results, etc. Medical coding professionals help ensure the codes are applied correctly during the medical billing process, which includes abstracting the information from documentation, assigning the appropriate codes, and creating a claim to be paid by insurance carriers.
Medical coding happens every time you see a healthcare provider. The healthcare provider reviews your complaint and medical history, makes an expert assessment of what’s wrong and how to treat you, and documents your visit. That documentation is not only the patient’s ongoing record, it’s how the healthcare provider gets paid.
And even they try to make it sound more glamorous that it is:
Like a musician who interprets the written music and uses their instrument to produce what's intended, Medical Coding requires the ability to understand anatomy, physiology, and details of the services, and the rules and regulations of the payers to succeed.
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Yup, medical coders is a thing, and for a time was a good paying job. For the computer "coding", it has a similar background - programmers wrote up a program from their desk, then handed it to "coders" to transcribe it into machine language, or an early programming language. "Programming" was the higher paying job, and "coding" was lower paying and considered clerical (and thus a lot of women got jobs in computing this way). This continued even up through the 70s; things like RPG-II you did all your prog
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They would identify procedures and their CPT codes and input them into the processing software.
TFW you get employed as a nearest neighbor search algorithm...
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Re: nothing (Score:2)
Wait.
They encode unstructured data into a format a computer can read the codes and do stuff? How could anyone refer to that as coding?!
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They encode unstructured data into a format a computer can read the codes and do stuff? How could anyone refer to that as coding?!
Because they don't using the word "coding" to refer to software programming. Medical billing and coding is a field with many roles such as coding specialist and insurance coder. They simply translate procedures and treatments given by medical providers (doctors / hospitals) into insurance codes to be given to payers (insurance companies). It is another very valid use of the word "coder" which has nothing to do with software development.
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Exactly, I believe medical coders are currently using the ICD-10-CM code set.
For you amusement check out codes V97.33XA and V97.33XD.
Yes this happens, sometimes more than once to the same person.
BTW: Proper coding is critical to a Hospitals financial health, government and insurance payments use those codes for reimbursements.
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Wait.
They encode unstructured data into a format a computer can read the codes and do stuff? How could anyone refer to that as coding?!
The terms "coding" and "coder" existed before the advent of computers; it was often used to describe various kinds of transcription jobs or repetitive data-entry work (such as entering columns of dates, sales figures temperatures, etc).
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Wait.
They encode unstructured data into a format a computer can read the codes and do stuff? How could anyone refer to that as coding?!
Maybe it was short for "encoding".
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Yeah, we need a sarc mark.
The interrobang didn't do its job.
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Ahh, indeed. Can slashdot display the actual symbol? (No, at least not in the message preview: "")
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However for generations now there has always been a debate if a coder is coding in a real language or some fluffed up software.
Binary vs Assembly: as those macros can get any dolt off the street to get a computer to work.
Assembly vs FORTRAN, COBOL, C. As you are separated by all the steps that really happen on the computer.
Compiled language vs interpreted.
Functional vs Procedural vs Object Oriented.
Knowing HTML with JavaScript and CSS you actually have a rather powerful set of coding at your fingertips, whe
This should be cut and dry (Score:4, Insightful)
If Lambda gets nothing until the student gets a career, and the contract states that, it's pretty simple.
There are a couple things going on though - that "misrepresented" bit. Some times people hear what they want to hear, and a written contract trumps all hearing and impressions.
Anyhow, if they did scam her and others, then they are a bunch of assholes who need curbstomped. Poor girl has enough on her plate already.
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But you seem to be missing the most important part to where the contract is null if they were operating without a license. If that is true they should not been able to charge for anything. For example if a landlord sues a tenant for unpaid rent but it turns out the dwelling was not licensed, then the landlord cannot collect. The tenant has to move out as the dwelling is illegal but they owe nothing.
Cut and dried, am I wrong?
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I am pointing out that the court does not have to look at the specific language of the contract if the contract itself should be voided. In my example, a landlord can show a judge a signed lease agreement the late rent fees but if the dwellings was illegal, the court does not even consider the fees.
I'm not disagreeing with you. If a license cannot be produced, she wins the case immediately. Cut and dried.
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In which jurisdiction does a coding camp school need a license?
License for what actually?
For example if a landlord sues a tenant for unpaid rent but it turns out the dwelling was not licensed, then the landlord cannot collect. The tenant has to move out as the dwelling is illegal but they owe nothing.
And in what jurisdiction would that be the case? Makes no sense, rent and contract is contract and rent.
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In which jurisdiction does a coding camp school need a license? License for what actually?
In a world where schools must be accredited? In a world where businesses need licenses to operate? What world do you live in where someone can create a school and charge for tuition without licensing?
And in what jurisdiction would that be the case?
In all jurisdictions where they regulate housing especially commercial housing. Again what world do you live in?
Makes no sense, rent and contract is contract and rent.
And if the contract is illegal, the courts should enforce the provisions? A landlord cannot collect rent on an illegal dwelling any more than a drug dealer cannot sue someone in court to collect on dr
What license (Score:2)
In a world where schools must be accredited?
That depends on a couple things. One is which schools a particular jurisdiction regulates and doesn't regulate, in order not to have to process paperwork from every individual giving guitar/piano lessons. Another is how long it takes for a newly established school to receive approval before operation. If this is excessive, the founders of a school are likely to choose to establish the school in a different state and direct prospective students in California to complain to the Bureau for Private Postsecondar
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One is which schools a particular jurisdiction regulates and doesn't regulate, in order not to have to process paperwork from every individual giving guitar/piano lessons
1) An individual is not a school. 2) How many individuals do you charge $30,000 for guitar lessons. 3) How many guitar teachers make their students sign contracts that says they get a portion of the students earning if they play guitar professionally. Why have you brought up this irrelevant example?
Another is how long it takes for a newly established school to receive approval before operation. If this is excessive, the founders of a school are likely to choose to establish the school in a different state and direct prospective students in California to complain to the Bureau for Private Postsecondary Education.
Again how is this relevant? The difficulty of complying with processes does not negate the fact that the school did not comply with them if the allegations are true.
How does an institution become accredited before enrolling its first student?
By following all the guidelines of accreditatio
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1) An individual is not a school. 2) How many individuals do you charge $30,000 for guitar lessons. 3) How many guitar teachers make their students sign contracts that says they get a portion of the students earning if they play guitar professionally.
1) At what point does a concern operated by an individual become a school? 2) At what price point does licensure become required? 3) Under what repayment arrangements does licensure become required?
Why have you brought up this irrelevant example?
I have tended to bring up extreme examples in order to understand the edges of a regulatory space before characterizing the inside of that space. If a space looks different at one point vs. another, then it'll look most different at the edges, and then those people discussing the space can search for where the di
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1) At what point does a concern operated by an individual become a school? 2) At what price point does licensure become required? 3) Under what repayment arrangements does licensure become required?
1) At what point do you engage in so much rampant speculation that it deviates away from the actual situation that you might as well ask what if the school was run but aliens from another world. 2) Again the school AS A BUSINESS needs a license. If you do not understand that they there is no hope for you
I have tended to bring up extreme examples in order to understand the edges of a regulatory space before characterizing the inside of that space.
Translation: I don’t care what the actual situation us, I am going to engage in speculation because I do not want to address reality.
If a space looks different at one point vs. another, then it'll look most different at the edges, and then those people discussing the space can search for where the discontinuities are. In other words: What are each of the thresholds that require an institution to become licensed for the first time?
Translation: I am going to ramble about other things that do not add
Re:This should be cut and dry (Score:5, Informative)
If she has the contract she signed with Lambda, and Lambda didn't follow that agreement, this should be an open and shut case.
As I am finding out, nothing is an open a shut case. I'm in the middle of suing a company over work done on my house. The contract I signed with them required forced arbitration if I had issues with them or the work. My lawyer sued to nullify that clause and won. We are now looking forward to a trial in a real court.
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If she has the contract she signed with Lambda, and Lambda didn't follow that agreement, this should be an open and shut case.
As I am finding out, nothing is an open a shut case. I'm in the middle of suing a company over work done on my house. The contract I signed with them required forced arbitration if I had issues with them or the work. My lawyer sued to nullify that clause and won. We are now looking forward to a trial in a real court.
Fortunately they nullified the arbitration. Must have been a major cockup by the company.
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It is not simple.
Perhaps she makes a second course elsewhere.
Then starts working - probably even in a lucrative job.
Then comes Lambda and claims they have entitlement to fees - then what?
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It is not simple. Perhaps she makes a second course elsewhere. Then starts working - probably even in a lucrative job. Then comes Lambda and claims they have entitlement to fees - then what?
Assuming that Lambda has this license she speaks of - she pays. If not, Lambda engaged in fraud. Here in the USA we have a concept called unclean hands. https://www.upcounsel.com/uncl... [upcounsel.com].
Usually used by a defense, the concept also applies if a plaintiff is suing with a claim of unclean hands, ie operation without a license. Proven = instant dismissal or guilt.
the sad part (Score:5, Insightful)
The sad part is that she could have done a few Udemy courses purchased on their frequent "sales" for less than $100 and gotten equivalent if not better education.
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Are there any good coding courses that can't be found online, for free? Universities and colleges are offering free audit of there courses, not just online but some will let you do it in person.
Re:the sad part (Score:5, Insightful)
The sad part is that she could have done a few Udemy courses purchased on their frequent "sales" for less than $100 and gotten equivalent if not better education.
You and I both know that, but someone who is on the outside trying to get in doesn't know that. She may not even been aware that Udemy existed, or that it would be suitable. At some point she had to trust someone that investing her time and money in their scheme would payoff for her.
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Indeed. In theory, you can give yourself a full MA-level CS education just using stuff online. In practice that is basically impossible because you do not know where you need to go and what you need to learn. The main contribution of an academic teacher is not teaching the material, it is selecting the material, more so in a still evolving field like CS/IT/coding.
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True, but you have to be pretty driven and do much more work than what's simply in a Udemy course. The problem is that people who are new to the field are oblivious on what to research and what skills employers need. You'd need to know exactly what courses to take in order for Udemy to be helpful, and then you'd need to know what you should be doing to supplement your courses. Even then, I probably wouldn't hire someone with no experience who had only taken Udemy classes. It's unlikely that this person woul
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Yea, that's not a thing in the US. Even state schools are prohibitively expensive and overcrowded. Udemy has some very good classes if you take the time to vet instructors.
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Here in Jesus Land (USA) that won’t even buy a semester of codes to unlock your ebooks.
Perfection vs shipping criterion. (Score:2)
Income sharing agreements are not perfect. But they are better than "Pay me full tuition up front. We guarantee nothing about employability"
The summary says it kicks in after getting a pay threshold. Limits total payments to 34K. No interest owed accrues. Looks like no time limit on when to repay. All are better terms than traditional tuition.
Can be improved, job should be due to skills learned. Could
I'm missing something (Score:2)
If Lambda gets repaid from the students' post-course incomes, isn't it in Lamba's best interest to get "graduates" placed so there are incomes from which they can get repaid?
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It should. But they can still be incompetent or trying to do it on a very low quality level, hence wasting the student's time.
I always wondered ... (Score:2)
about these sorts of courses (esp. in programming, since I'm all self-taught) and their promises of post-course employment. I certainly wouldn't mind a 17% payout if I could get a decent job in something I enjoyed, but I guess for some it just doesn't work out.
I wonder how many that "some" is.
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I wonder how many that "some" is.
My guess would be "many" and the trend will be "even more". Bad code has always been exceptionally expensive and very slowly that awareness is seeping into the industry.
"Single mom" relevant? ... I hope she wins though. (Score:2)
Is it relevant that she's a single mom? Not really. I *do* hope she wins this case though, epic style. To much riff-raff in the web and agency space and way to many shady recruiter gigs and "coding bootcamp" snakeoil sellers around.
Way too much, way too often and way too long.
Sue them into next wednesday I say.
Especially if they were as fraudulent as the blurb indicates.
$30k/year for an unaccredited online school? (Score:2)
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Like the story says, she's a single mom, so we automatically know her decision making is bottom of the barrel stupid.
Yup.
Clearly she poorly chose a husband who didn't die from murder disease, auto wreck, COVID in spite of being vaxxed. Or she poorly chose a husband who was amazing and later turned out to be a terrible human being that left her.
Yup, you're the smarter one who chose mom's basement instead of having a mate.
Accreditation Matters (Score:5, Informative)
I work at a University. Accredited courses matter when it comes to getting hired. Not all accrediting bodies are competent, and not all programs even have accreditation, but if you're paying tens of thousands of dollars for a product you should aim for the product that has had scrutiny placed on it by experts in the field. That's the purpose of accreditation; I'm not a nurse, or a teacher, so I have no idea if some college that claims to teach nursing is any good or not. If the school regularly has their curriculum and methods examined by a third-party expert panel of nurses and teachers at least there is a better chance that the curriculum is valuable.
And it's not just the student that gains trust... so do the potential employers of the graduates.
So accreditation, like unions, have varying degrees of quality and value but in general it's safer and more valuable to get an accredited degree than one that nobody has examined or confirmed has any utility at all.
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Of course, part of the problem is lazy HR. In the '70s the path to being a computer programmer started with an aptitude test given by someone's HR department. If you did well and otherwise passed an interview, you would be hired to an entry level position (actual entry level, a level not seen in several decades) where you would learn to program and/or operate a computer. After that, your experience was all that mattered on your resume.
The next generation learned much of it in their teen years on home comput
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That's the purpose of accreditation; I'm not a nurse, or a teacher, so I have no idea if some college that claims to teach nursing is any good or not
From what I remember there was a class action lawsuit against one of those for-profit online schools where their graduates could not find jobs because their nursing degrees were worthless. Nurses like doctors have to gain some on the job experience while going through school. Those that do not are not looked at twice by many hospitals.
Boot camps are (Score:4, Insightful)
A get rich quick scheme
A true sign of the times (Score:2)
And what should I see right in the middle of TFA? And advertisement saying "The online school that invests in you". It then further blathers that you can train remotely to become a software engineer or data scientist, pay nothing up front.
Read between the lines (Score:2)
The job placement rate doesn't tell the whole story. How many of these people had relevant experience before they got the job? Most employers aren't going to want to hire a programmer with no relevant experience.
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How should someone gain relevant work experience before being hired for the first time? By starting one's own business?
Or it could be... (Score:2)
Development is hard. (Score:3)
I don't know why people don't get that. It's not something any old Schmoe off the street can just take a few courses and do proficiently, or even competently. If you need evidence of this, consider that even the best, shiniest software written by people paid $300k a year who have been dweeby geek-nerds since they were 6 years old is often shit that breaks when you most need it not to.
Now, before the "oh, it's not that hard crowd" - sure, not all of it is literal rocket science, but as someone who even knows SlashDot exists, much less posts there, you are a filthy geeky dweebo-nerd so don't apply your standards to the average normal, functioning person.
Re:Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:4, Insightful)
This is unobjectionable and I don't object to it. What really does stick in my craw is people trying to turn themselves into sob stories solely for the purpose of litigating a case in the press.
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Then stop objecting, moron.
Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:2)
Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:5, Insightful)
Honestly the "Single mom" part of the title annoyed me the most. What relevance does her personal life have with anything pointed out here other than to paint her as more of a victim?
This is just insulting the reader's intelligence.
Re:Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
I don't think it's a "self-help scheme" and while this is the first negative piece I've read on Bloom, I'll try to keep an open mind. Overall I like the model - learn job skills in exchange for a percent of your salary for a few years. This is much better than what we have currently where you are massively in debt for an advanced degree via student loans. Many of our prized institutions, which are more than happy to increase tuition rates and expenses in general, have long since abandoned the pre 1980s(ish)
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On the face of it that sounds alright, but it may be tricky to adjudicate whether the salary was due to the skills.
Let's say somebody is tired of working as a barista so they get a degree in underwater basket weaving from a diploma mill in exchange for $100,000 of their future earnings. The graduate looks for a few months and finds no jobs in that field. On the face of it the school should go out of bu
Re:Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:2)
Thank you for restoring my faith in humanity.
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It serves to humanise her & drive home the point that Lambda's students are real human beings
How is a single mom any more real than all the other students?
I agree her bringing that up was playing a victim card.
If she's right she's right, regardless of her being a single mom.
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It is no real difference if a headline starts with
a) Single Mom
b) former Astronaut
c) Quarterback
You guys are just hypocritical morons. After all "the single mom" is not responsible for the article.
If you do not like catchy - and this case even correct - headlines: then stop reading news.
Or is it so that you all are so old fashioned that you still hate single moms?
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You're annoyed that they think they can emotionally influence people so easily.
The irony, it burns!
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Not gonna lie, you got me.
Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:2)
Because it's an appeal to fee fees and tugging at people's heartstrings.
I wish news sites would just report the facts in a completely neutral manner, but the opposite has become the defacto standard.
Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:2)
IOW, the facts you want to hear.
Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:2)
I think it says a lot that a detail like that annoys you.
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Mechanics are unlicensed, so if their business wasn't properly registered it wouldn't give their customers any case against them at all.
It is more like an unlicensed accountant doing your taxes, or an unlicensed doctor.
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Re: Alternate title (read to the end) (Score:3)
What does victim blaming accomplish here?