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Wind River Moving Towards Linux 100
An anonymous reader writes "LinuxDevices reports that Wind River, the world's #1 embedded software company, moved two steps closer to Linux today, with a pair of announcements that it has joined two key organizations. Wind River has joined the Open Source Development Labs (OSDL) and says it plans to contribute to the OSDL's Carrier Grade Linux (CGL) working group. Wind River also announced that it has joined the Eclipse Consortium, an industry group devoted to an open cross-vendor platform for development tools integration, and that it is committed to the Eclipse platform 'to enable global enterprises to standardize embedded development on a single, open standards-based integrated development environment (IDE).' This follows an October Linux tools announcement which it called 'just the first step.'" We had also covered the initial announcement.
Hmm (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Hmm (Score:3, Informative)
Wasnt wind river one of the SCO posterchildren (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes, SCO + WRS == true love affair (Score:3, Informative)
Yep. Asked about the 'silent majority' that, according the the paranoid delusions of Mc-soon-to-be-Prison-Bride WindRiver is with SCO with concern to the GPL:
Re:Yes, SCO + WRS == true love affair (Score:2)
Actually, he probably is, sort of, right. But most people seem to believe that "fair" competition should be met honorably. And it's often possible to turn things into a win for most, or all, parties. Customers, somehow, often aren't considered as part of the relevant parties. But I count them that way. Of course, I don't own a business...
And there is substantial evidence that SCO
Plan A or Plan B Linux Adoption Strategies (Score:5, Funny)
Plan B - Close eyes and ears as long as possible, then move to Plan A
Looks like they went for Plan B.
Re:Plan A or Plan B Linux Adoption Strategies (Score:1, Funny)
SCO (Score:4, Interesting)
Re: (Score:1)
Re:SCO (Score:1)
Do you mean as a development host platform?
Re:SCO (Score:2, Informative)
Not a surprise (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Not a surprise (Score:1)
Do you mean on Linux (hosting tools) or for Linux (as target)?
Re:Not a surprise (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Not a surprise (Score:1)
The latter, driving the former.
Me wonders... (Score:1)
Unless they want to provide their source code for all, their migration to Open Source may stop just short of Linux.
Clif
Re:Me wonders... (Score:1)
Mucho apologies.
Re:Me wonders... (Score:3, Interesting)
The only change for them in going GPL might be to switch from a per-unit sales model to an outright-buy one to prevent their customers from getting their
GPL source re-compiled elsewhere after the first box is delivere
Re:Me wonders... (Score:2, Interesting)
In cases like these, the GPL is a hindrance...and it is easy to see why. They don't want everyone with a computer, an idea, and the appropriate compiler to be able to release their own ROM updates for their devices.
For many of these companies, the GPL is in the way of their adoption of Open Source solutions....which seems self defeating for the OS movement.
Re:Me wonders... (Score:2)
Despite the name (Score:2)
Re:Despite the name (Score:1)
Re:Despite the name (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course, sometimes companies change. But don't believe it just because they say it, don't believe it until AFTER they have proven it.
And even then... IBM has been a good friend recently. But I still keep a wary eye on them, in memory of things past.
Also, consider: Without Sun, OpenOffice.org wouldn't exist. We owe Sun a tremendous debt. But
Slackware (Score:5, Interesting)
Slackware had some very insecure months after Wind River took over Walnut Creek and cut Slackware loose.
Re:Slackware (Score:1, Interesting)
Oh, right, screw you Wind River.
JoeR
Got Slack?
Re:Slackware (Score:5, Interesting)
Screw them.
I doubt this effort is going to improve their rapport in the Linux community anyway. Imagine...taking one of the finest and most stable Linux distros avail and tossing them out on their asses to fend for themselves...and then deciding 2 years later that it might have been a mistake.
Even if Patrick sprinkled this with Holy Water.....I'd never feel comfortable doing business with such short-sightedness.
Again...screw them.
Re:Slackware (Score:2, Informative)
See Also here:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/ar c hive/5/ 2001/04/4/1991
and here:
http://www.internetnews.com/dev-news/articl e.php/7 34561
And so you see, from just these 2 articles, that WR really just wanted BSD, because well, the BSD license lets them continue the properietary licensed and royalty generatig scheme they are used to.
Fortunately for us, they did not see that Slackware is genuinely useful for creating embedded systems. Mine (see earlier) runs on a x386 with 12Mb fla
I love Eclipse (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:I love Eclipse (Score:2, Funny)
Pretty sweet IDE compared to my years of using visual studio
I like SCSI compared to my years of using Code Warrior. Oh wait, sorry...
Re:I love Eclipse (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:I love Eclipse (Score:1)
I use VS to edit c/c++ and Java code but all of the code is compiled on Unix/Linux boxes.
GPL is causing Wind River wariness of Linux? (Score:5, Interesting)
In this article by Mike Downing of Integrated Communications Design, Wind River's Vice President of Corporate Marketing, Curt Schacker, expresses his company's concerns about the viability of using GPL-based software (like Linux) in embedded applications. "More customers are telling us that they see interesting aspects to Linux . . . but we're seeing a growing problem due to the growing uncertainty of using GPL-based code in embedded development," says Wind Rivers's Schaker according to Downing.
What are the options for revising the GPL, if any?
Re:GPL is causing Wind River wariness of Linux? (Score:5, Interesting)
Why revise it? Its not like its the only software license in the world, or for that matter the only "open" license. If Wind River doesn't like the GPL it can always use BSDi (which it owns) or anything else under the BSD license. Problem solved.
What the f? (Score:2)
Keerist, the gall of some people
Re:GPL is causing Wind River wariness of Linux? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:GPL is causing Wind River wariness of Linux? (Score:2)
BSD, GPL, EiffelForum, Artistic, Modified GPL (as used in GNAT), LGPL, MPL, NPL,
The GPL is good as it is (Score:2, Insightful)
The GPL is not intended to promote bussiness or propietary software. If that is your intention you need another license.
Re:GPL is causing Wind River wariness of Linux? (Score:2)
Translation:
"More customers are telling us that they see interesting aspects to Linux . . . but we're seeing a growing problem due to the fact that GPL does not let us take other people's ideas, make money off them, close off the source, and then dump the develope
I don't think you understand the GPL... (Score:2)
Linux, the kernel and most of the components to make up a complete OS, are essentially free software, for us to use, imporove on, build on. People spent a lot of hard hours on this software.
So tell me, why should we "revise" the GPL and allow corporations to take Linux, label it something else, and sell back to people, closed source? They didn't write Linux, they didn't pay for it, so they shouldn't be able to do this.
If a company wan
Who'd of thought it would come to this? (Score:5, Informative)
In fact, the project was one that had been 'orphaned' by Wind River, because they had bought out ISI, and 'deep-sixed' PSOS (thanks, guys). Faced with having to re-write all the OS interfaces in the code to upgrade to faster processors, we figured it would be just about as much trouble to move to a Linux-based system, and that would 'future-proof' us against further corporate shenanigans.
I had used VxWorks in the past on other projects, and had achieved a nice working relationship with the local Wind River sales and engineering support folks. Wind River's behavior over the last few years, though, has pretty much destroyed that.
Wind River may be trying to jump on the band wagon now, but it may already be too late. Folks like me have long memories.
Re:Who'd of thought it would come to this? (Score:1, Redundant)
We shot them down in flames on that one.
not TOO suprising (Score:2, Informative)
All I know about Wind River is... (Score:5, Interesting)
I never knew what "ashen faced" was until I asked if I could add a couple bits to a status packet (and this was still in the design phase when things are supposed to be fluid).
Re:All I know about Wind River is... (Score:2)
To be fair, though, I think it has something to do with category 5 software assurance where they check every line of code with a magnifying glass. Twice. And then they check again. Three times.
Wind River and open source (Score:5, Informative)
I don't want to bash BSD - in fact I use it both as a desktop and on a server, and I love it. I like it better than linux, while I like the licence of Linux better than BSD. The moment a company adopts a software under the BSD licence, it has too choices. It can keep it open source (in which case it would use it almost as if it were GPL) or make it closed source (relinquishing the advantages of the Open Source development model). I believe the two balance each other out, but the BSD licence makes code exchange between linux development and BSD development (both excellent and cutting edge softwares) a one way road, which is not a good thing in the long run imho.
Anyhow, this news confirms that the favorite claims of BSD users, that is to say, the BSD licence is more corporate friendly, is not necessarily true. Wind River was known to be a BSD company (they still sell BSDi 5.0) but they are on the way of becoming a linux company (well, not a linux company per se, but a company that supports - and favors - linux instead of BSD, despite the licence.) It seems that the embedded BSD project (link [daemonnews.org]) is not quite flourishing.
Business Friendly License (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Business Friendly License (Score:3, Interesting)
What's business friendly about a competitor taking your stuff, adding secret sauce to it, and then freezing you out of a market you may have created?
That is why it is usually one company that is heavily involved with any particular GPL project. As they hold the copyright, they can still release proprietary releases (StarOffice). Any other comp
Re:Business Friendly License (Score:3, Insightful)
This is pure FUD. No one can make BSD code proprietary. Yes, they can add their own stuff to it, and keep their version to themselves. But the origial code is as free as it ever was. The only way for a competitor to "freeze you out" is for them to enhance the codebase to such an extent that you can't do so yourself. And at that point I think there might be a credible argument that the creator of those enhancements deserves to profit from them if they wish. You may argue differently -- I've no problem with
Windriver Sales Tactics (Score:4, Interesting)
I wouldn't get too excited about anything Windriver does concerning Linux. I recently finished a project utilizing VxWorks 5.5. At every turn we were informed that we didn't currently own the package we needed to do some functionality. Of course the new package would be another $xxxx.xx or more per developer (Often plus royalty). I'm not talking about off the wall support either. Things like write protecting the program text require an additional purchase to be supported.
I'm not saying that Windriver's products are bad. In fact, I'm a fan of VxWorks in comparison to some of their competitors. I'm cautious because Windriver is a wolf in sheep's clothing. (Think Micro$oft of the RTOS world.)
Wind River == WIN DRIVER (Score:3, Insightful)
Conspiracy theorists go nuts!
Seriously, who pays this company for what and why should they even care? They bought Walnut Creek CDROM when the consumer Internet connections got fast enough for people to stop buying CDROMs full of free software. Why? Walnut Creek hosted a big FTP server and had some CDROM mastering coing on. Did Wind River need distribution for their products to get them out to a wider audience? Why is there both BSDMall.com and FreeBSDMall.com?
In this day and age you should know to understand a business by the needs it fills and whose cash is represented in sales. Wind River is a mystery. Proceed with caution.
Keep the River out of Linux! (Score:4, Informative)
The VxWorks system has never had good memory protection. I think every CPU ever made for ten years now has had an MMU on board... Geez. And yet, every task running has full Read/Write access to every other task's memory, including the OS's memory.
I could go on, but if any contributions are of this sort of quality, then no thanks.
Re:Keep the River out of Linux! (Score:1)
Re:Keep the River out of Linux! (Score:1)
As to the shared memory for each task... You can actually create private task evironments using VX_PRIVATE_ENV as an option for taskSpawn. Just remember that any device drivers initialized with handles in a task will no longer be available once that task shuts down!
Too little...Too late... (Score:1)
Not only did they fight the open source movement for some time, but now that they are hurting they look to embrace it. Those of you who have tried to work with Wind River tech support to solve problems with device drivers and software issues have probably experienced the frustration and head banging of trying to get results. The lack of support, secretive nature of the
wither TRON? (Score:2)
Hey Eclipsecon is supporting us with banner ads... (Score:1)
somwhere in a smoke-filled room at Slashdot headquarters... Eclipse is buying banners... let's be sure to mention Eclipse in some stories.
buyout bait? Or poison pill? (Score:1)
Buy out Wind River and migrate WR's customer base to WinCE.
But if WR makes it much easier for their customers to move to Linux, and many of them do, Linux will have beaten MS handily in 2 areas (servers and embedded).
2 reasons for MS to buy WR - increase their own market share and deny Linux that market share.
Haven't they realized yet? (Score:2)
Haven't they realized yet, the problem that is distribute Free Software embedded systems?
It really sux, you must provide a way to upgrade firmware, so you need to provide an interface. That's not easy.
To tell the truth I don't know exactly what is needed to be in conformity to GPL, but I'll tell you a thing, allow firmware upgrades in certain devices is not easy, and in many cases will increase product price.
Imagine yourself upgrading your FreeSoftware-CarStereo.
I hope they find easy ways to do suc
We Suck Less (Score:1)
Why is Eclipse anything to do with Linux? (Score:1)
Graham