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Microsoft

Microsoft Releases Visual Studio 2017 (visualstudio.com) 195

Reader Anon E. Muss writes: Microsoft on Tuesday released Visual Studio 2017. The latest version of the venerable Integrated Development Environment supports a variety of languages (C/C++, C#, VB.net, F#, Javascript/Typescript, Python, etc.) and targets classic "Win32" desktop, Universal Windows Platform (UWP, also known as "Metro"), .NET, ASP, node.js, etc.). A "Community Edition" is available at no cost for individual developers and those working on open source software. "Professional" and "Enterprise" editions are available for corporate developers, at prices sure to shock whoever has to sign the check.
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Microsoft Releases Visual Studio 2017

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  • by xxxJonBoyxxx ( 565205 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @02:47PM (#53994015)
    crappy summary for the slashdot crowd. we know what visual studio is - what we want to know is what, if anything, changed
    • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @03:00PM (#53994133)

      VS2017 Release Notes [visualstudio.com]

      • I only need to know two things:

        a) Does Intellisense work yet?

        b) How long until SP1?

    • VS is not my first choice when developing software (it's not terrible, but feels bloated and heavy), but I need to use it for some of my work development tasks (lots of Windows-focused .NET stuff). The things I'm most interested in, at the moment, are the improvements in support for ES2015, JSX, and node.js integration.
      • VS (Community - haven't needed anything more in years) is still my first choice if I have control over my Windows environment, but I've also started using "SharpDevelop" on machines where I want a portable ASP.NET or C# development environment (since you can run it without installing anything)
    • Linux support for VC++ is mentioned seems pretty big. [microsoft.com]

      Also a mac version is in preview and better Android and IOS development with Xamarin is included.

  • Or it is so cheap that will shock the one signing the check?
  • $500 is Shocking??? (Score:5, Informative)

    by turp182 ( 1020263 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @02:59PM (#53994111) Journal

    The Professional version is $500 (license, not subscription):
    https://www.visualstudio.com/v... [visualstudio.com]

    That seems very reasonable.

    Enterprise is quite a bit more ($6K for new, $2.6K to renew), but it is part of the MSDN Enterprise (previously Ultimate I believe, that's what my license is called at this time), you get access to almost everything MS has ever made (want Windows 3.1 or DOS 6, it's there, want enterprise SQL Server, it's there).

    Here's the link to the prices:
    https://www.visualstudio.com/v... [visualstudio.com]

    • by dontbemad ( 2683011 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @03:11PM (#53994203)
      I think what is shocking to the vocally anti-Microsoft (and proprietary software in general, for that matter) crowd on slashdot is that people can get away with charging MONEY for SOFTWARE.

      It never ceases to amaze me how, despite the fact that the majority of us on this website make our money in tech or software, the idea of charging money for those services is revolting to some.
      • And this is just for desktop development. I can't imagine what most people here would say about automotive/aerospace, embedded toolchains. Nothing opensource comes close. The money is still cheaper than engineering time.

        Simulink Embedded Coder [mathworks.com], VXWorks [wikipedia.org], Green Hill INTEGRITY RTOS [wikipedia.org], ByteCraft eTPU compiler [bytecraft.com], Ashware eTPU compiler [ashware.com], Vector CANape [vector.com], and on.

        That doesn't even touch on the cost of development boards.

      • by Billly Gates ( 198444 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @04:42PM (#53994823) Journal

        The community edition is not the crippled express editions. You can even make professional software with it too. THe only difference is the MSDN subscription and corporate Team Foundation features for teams and groups.

        THe Community Edition even comes with Git and Git tools to use for things like Github.

        So why is everyone whining? Things are not free to make and like Redhat there is CentOS for those who do not need enterprise support but is there for those that do.

        • ANd yes replying to myself I also want to address the grand parent for things like SQL Server.

          If you want the full thing go to www.technet.com and download it? It timebombs after 180 days but MS allows you to run it and Windows Server Enterprise editions free for non production or business use for IT professionals in virtual or stand alone machines. The Community Edition comes with SQL Server Express but I downloaded both the SQL Server for Linux 2016 and the regular win64 SQL Sever 2014 and Server 2012 R2

      • I charge money for the software I make. I think that most Microsoft software just isn't worth the price.
    • by Kjella ( 173770 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @03:43PM (#53994437) Homepage

      $500 is Shocking???

      The submitter is probably measuring that in Ramen noodles while being a squatter on campus like his idol, because software wants to be like, free, man. And I'd show him our SQL Server Enterprise bill, but I fear he'd go into cardiac arrest. For us Visual Studio is just a rounding error for SSIS/SSAS/SSRS development.

    • We had a contractor from a developing country on our team. He was really upset when he found out how much we were paying for Visual Studio Enterprise, because it was really close to his total salary.
    • Agreed. Submitter should think about it this way. How much per-year does a typical programmer earn? Does $500 or even $6K for a perpetual license software for a tool said developer will probably use every day for several years sound expensive? It's stupidly inexpensive, relatively speaking, to the total cost of that programmer's general overhead.

      It's a decent chunk of money for an individual developer, but then again, they can simply use the Community Edition for free.

  • Now if they would just make it standards compliant and add basic endian macros, it would be even greater!

    • by Jezral ( 449476 )

      You're in luck: https://twitter.com/StephanTLa... [twitter.com] - "We’re planning to ship most C++17 features in VS 2017 updates. No ETAs yet, but we’re working on them as a top priority."

      • Features are great but standard compliance is what I'm interested in. That means getting all the nitty-gritty details right so that standards compliant code works with their compiler instead of whining about errors that don't exist.

  • I use and like VS quite a lot, but am not precisely an early adopter. At the moment, I am mostly using the 2012 version and, eventually (= when forced to do so), the 2015 one. Actually, I am not even sure why I stopped using VS 2010 because it was quite reliable. I have seen some problems with 2012, but have gradually got used to them. I haven't used 2015 much, but don't think that I like it: it consumes too many resources, even for my a-bit-old-but-quite-powerful desktop computer.

    I am currently downloading the 2017 Community (clarification which is perhaps still required: fully-functional free version, which has nothing to do with the old VS Express) and everything looks OK so far. The downloading interface seems nicer than the previous ones. Microsoft promised this version to be much more modular and apparently they delivered. I am saying apparently because the options are there, although the size is still quite big anyway (over 7 GB after having chosen the most basic options).
    • by xvan ( 2935999 )
      2012 brings c++11 support.
      • Every new .NET/Visual Studio version brings something new which some people might find relevant and others might not. In my case, I use VS mostly for C# & VB.NET and rarely with new .NET features. Over 99% of all the code which I write in VS might be done with VS 2010 (and .NET 3.5). Sometimes, I need newer versions and plainly rely on them. For example, while contributing to the open .NET project (CoreCLR and CoreFX), I had to use VS 2015.
      • I'm using C++14 right now, for free, using GCC.

        • Last I looked, most of C++14 is in VS 2015. VC++ does lag annoyingly behind g++ and clang in standards conformance, but it catches up to the standard eventually.

          • VC++ does lag annoyingly behind g++ and clang in standards conformance, but it catches up to the standard eventually.

            Wow, that must suck. Meanwhile, I have two great compilers, gcc and clang, that both do a great job of tracking the standard and, by all appearances, are just generally better than VC++. For free.

    • After testing it for some minutes, I found two interesting issues:
      - It loads pretty quickly. Right after restarting my computer, the fastest one is VS 2012, then 2017 and, finally, 2015. But, when executing them for a second time, 2017 becomes even faster than 2012.
      - It has some new project types (.NET Core and .NET Standard), which are only present in C# (no more duplication of everything C#-VB.NET?!). And here I found a not so pleasant surprise: after creating a new .NET Standard project and the opening w
    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      It's great that those of us who just want C and C# without all the web and SQL shit can get that now.

  • by Opportunist ( 166417 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @03:14PM (#53994219)

    In the last VS I had to add a compiler option [geeks3d.com] to stop you from sneaking your snooping crap into my code, what is it going to be this time?

    Yours,

    An Ex-VS user.

  • Does anyone know if they've fixed the privacy concerns about the Community edition yet?

    Last time I checked, there were multiple inter-related privacy policies that seemed to apply, but between those and the general terms it seemed clear that they could upload more-or-less anything (including, say, your code) through their telemetry processes. You also needed a Microsoft account to even continue using the IDE after a few days.

    This sort of nonsense simply shouldn't be necessary in real world development tools

  • FYI: No ISO download (Score:4, Informative)

    by rastos1 ( 601318 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @04:11PM (#53994619) Homepage
    But you should be able to create an offline installer [microsoft.com]
    • The offline installer process has worked fine for me for the RC.

      It actually seems to be working better with the officially released version.

    • Thank you. Was looking for a way to download this for my team without re-downloading for every user.
    • by MobyDisk ( 75490 )

      Expect it to take a long time though: So far it has downloaded 10GB of files and has >3300 top-level folders. No progress indication. :-(

      • by rastos1 ( 601318 )
        I just keep some windows VMs around. On Win2008 server it failed outright. On W10 it exhausted the disk space after a short while. So I started to look around how big the beast actually is. The HW requirements says - up to 40GB; based on selected features. The offline installer can be forced to download less if you restrict it only one language (who would want a localized IDE??), e.g. with "--lang en-US" - which trims it down to ~19GB ... I think I'll pass for now.
        • by MobyDisk ( 75490 )

          FYI: Final result, without using --lang, is ~16.3GB (17,595,078,265 bytes) and 4,606 files.

  • by Billly Gates ( 198444 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2017 @04:38PM (#53994779) Journal

    No I am not making this up either [microsoft.com]. Also a beta version of Visual Studio for Mac is available too as well as better Android and IOS support. VS since 2015 also comes with Java and Android emulators as well via Hyper-V.

    MS is getting quite serious about being cross platform [microsoft.com]

  • Now Satya has to do the song and dance, "developers, developers, developers ...." [youtube.com]. But this time the music will be arranged by AR Rahman, and the famed dance coach Puliyur Saroja who directed the dances of the Superstar Rajnikant will choreograph the performance.
  • It says 2017, but that might be misleading -- it does not fully support C++x14 (release notes say "better" x14 support. I'd like to see "full x14 compliance & support"). And they're a ways from full x17 support.

    You get spoiled using Clang/LLVM

    • It says 2017, but that might be misleading -- it does not fully support C++x14 (release notes say "better" x14 support. I'd like to see "full x14 compliance & support"). And they're a ways from full x17 support.

      You get spoiled using Clang/LLVM

      Apparently it has all the stuff added in C++14, what is missing is C++11 and C++98 support :D

      See VS2017 Release Notes - C++ [visualstudio.com]

      the compiler is complete for features added in the C++14 Standard. Note that the compiler still lacks a few features from the C++11 and C++98 Standards.

    • Go use Clang then? It is included in VS 2015 and VS 2017

    • by Jezral ( 449476 )

      They are actively working on full C++ language support. But, 2017 doesn't mean C++17 - the release year has nothing to do with what it supports. The actual version is VS15 (VS 2015 was version 14).

      MS is working on language support in two ways. First, they're trying to get two-phase lookup into their own frontend, but this has been very slow work because it doesn't even have an AST. Secondly, they're working on an Clang based frontend, which already has all the goodies. You can already install the Clang prev

  • I once installed the 2015 Community edition on a Windows 7 system to check it out, kick the tires, etc.

    It shit all over the system, there was no integrated installer (of the type there is when you install Microsoft Office) and it created 'restore points' for every single package and component that it pulled down and installed. I wanted to maybe check out some Visual Basic and C++ and dabble with it a bit.

    It installed the whole SQL tool chain, server, etc. There really weren't any options for installing ju

    • VS2017 has a new installer that's supposed to be better at managing components, languages, etc. I haven't tried it myself though, so I can't give a recommendation either way.

  • Meanwhile, in other news, Bram Moolenaar releases vim 8

  • The last time I installed VC (taking several hours)... it was not able to completely un-install. It wrapped itself around IE and popped up a debugger every time IE encountered a buggy web page.

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